Schefter: Cassel (and Vrabel) to Chiefs for 2009 2nd-rounder [merged]

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

How many picks do we now have in the 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounds?

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

cupofjoe1962 said:

I have not problem with getting the #34 pick.

This is now a very important draft in the Patriots future.
I would not be suprised to see them trade one of our 3 - 2nd round picks for a established player from another NFL team.

I would love to see us add TJ Houshmandzadeh.

We just freed up 18 million dollars in this trade,

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This is key... people here forget we have players like Wilfork to tie up. The trade was ok. Nothing spectacular but necessary.

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

I agree that it sounds like we should have gotten more. However, people said the same thing when we traded #28 in 2007 to SF, and when we traded #69 last year to SD. In both cases we ended up doing well.

Besides, some of the people howling that we got robbed were also saying that they wouldn't want the #3 pick, or would rather have a mid-20's pick. #34 is 1st round value at a 2nd round price. Some of the same people complaining that Cassel's franchise tag was killing us are now crying that we got robbed.

I also wonder if the Pats have more planned. Say, for example, trading #34 (or #23) for Julius Peppers? Some people liked the idea of trading Cassel and #23 for #3 and #34 and then trading #3 for Peppers; if we traded #23 for Peppers it would end up leaving us with exactly the same scenario, #34/47/58 on the 1st day. That would be a coup. Then we could sign Lee Bodden and target secondary/WR/OL help in the draft to fill the holes.

I don't think we are done by any means.

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

on the surface, it looks like we got ripped in this deal...but i want to wait until the entire FA/draft is over an evaluate then. Who knows what BB will do will all these picks and what players he might get. I would have loved to get #3 and take Curry, but lets just wait until the whole thing shakes out.

This i do know...BB and the Pats front office are much smarter than I or anyone on this board, that is for sure. In BB we trust!

Re: Peter King reporting 09 2nd rounder from Chiefs

Wow what a disappointment. I just don't see the "value" from the Pats perspective.

Chiefs fans have to be ecstatic with the first deal by their new GM - a starting OLB one year removed from the pro bowl and the tenth-rated passer in the league in 2008 - all for a #2 pick!

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

This ended up benefiting both teams. Sure, I would have liked to receive more. I assume Vrabes would have just been cut had he not been traded to KC. Teh press release shows how much respect Bill had for Vrabes. Vrabes was the only guy who could make fun of Bill and get away with it!

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

All things considered, if Brady is good to go, I have no problem WHATSOEVER with the 33rd pick in this year's draft for Cassel and Vrabel. People rightfully love Mike Vrabel, but he would have almost been a liability on the field this year (not to mention his cap hit).

And most here WAY overestimated what other teams would be willing to give for Cassel based on cold analysis of his play in one season as our QB.

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

AllstonPatsFan said:

I'm not sure how you can conclude this. You have no idea what the market was like. The #34 pick really like a first round pick. Plus, would you rather keep Cassel here at 14 million a year?

I know it's not what we though we were going to get but I'm happy with this. Clears up cap space too.

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The reason why we are mad is because there are many teams out there with plenty of cap room and no QB. So you're telling me that a team like Tampa Bay with 60 million in cap room with the 20th overall selection and no QB didn't want to trade for Matt Cassel? In fact, the Chiefs were the only team that would trade for Matt Cassel? How does Matt Shaub require more compensation to get him out of Atlanta than Matt Cassel? Complete bull****!

Re: Peter King reporting 09 2nd rounder from Chiefs

This trade definitely improves the Patriots.

We gain a late first round caliber player (its a deep draft) for four years at a reasonable cost.

We lose one year of service from a quality backup QB, who hopefully would never have seen the field.

We lose one year of service from an aging LB whose on-field value wasn't worth his cap number, and whose off-field value is better appreciated elsewhere.

We get rid of $17M+ in cap space for 2009 (going into a potentially uncapped year in which many key starters will be free agents, so we need that money if we want to keep them from testing the waters).

I am breathing a sigh of relief that we didn't get stuck carrying Cassel.


Could we have gotten more from elsewhere? Maybe. I expect to see media reports to that effect. To the extent that executives in Detroit or TB had plans to sit back and wait for the Cassel market to soften, it is safe that they won't repeat that mistake in the future. But it is uncertain that such a deal would have been consummated. If it was, it would have come too late for the Patriots to consider being active in free agency.


I also think it is possible for BB and Pioli to negotiate deals that include future good will for one side or the other. Pioli couldn't afford to be seen as giving BB a good deal. BB has no such problem on his end. BB also starts off owing Pioli some good will for not taking the deal with Seattle.


People who wanted the #3 for Cassel and Vrabel are being greedy. Yes, we occasionally get insane deals like the Moss deal. But that is a very unusual thing; something to be celebrated, not expected.


As far as the Matt Schaub deal goes: that was an insane deal favoring Atlanta, and everybody knew it at the time the deal occurred. It is a poor benchmark to use in judging the Cassel deal.

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

salty said:

OK, to me it doesn't really matter much that Vrabel was involved in this deal. He is 34 years old and on the decline, so you really can't have expected much for him. Traded alone, he probably would have netted a sixth rounder--fifth at best.

But that said, I'll be a little dissapointed if the Pats only got a second rounder (albeit a very high second) for Cassel. They should've at least got a conditional 2010 pick--something like a third rounder, but with the potential to be a second or even a first if Cassel made the pro bowl, KC made the playoffs, etc.

If the Pats truly did get only that 2nd round pick, then my guess is the market just must not have been there for Cassel. The Pats couldn't hold on to him forever with that $14.6 million price tag.

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I think that Pioli is looking like the genius that he is here......I think the Pats got a little impatient thinking that they may not be able to move Matt by the draft......and they let him go on the cheap.....Vrabs still has plenty left in the tank for the next couple of years and still had some value.....to let BOTH of them go simply for a second rounder is jaw dropping........Cassel should have been able to fetch a #1 I would think........all the talking heads had him getting a #1 pick..........go figure.....in BB we trust.....

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

This is a f*cking joke!

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

dont forget that this is one of the deeper drafts in a long time, the 34 can net us a stud LB or Saftey

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

Yea I was starting to be worried about us being frozen on extensions and FAs, but we still didn't get enough IMO.

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

kurtinelson said:

Where were the other teams offers? If KC was the only team with interest, I think we were lucky to get what we did. Its not like keeping Cassel on the roster at $14 million a year was an option.

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Well the draft is not exactly tomorrow, so we could have easily waited and fielded better offers. I have a feeling the Lions would have given us the 20th pick for Cassel and Vrabel. Just wait and see when the Panther get this years plus next years first rounders for Peppers. Wow I am simply stunned!!!!

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

I wonder if the Pats have something else up their sleeves - like #23 or #34 to Carolina for Peppers? In that case we would essentially be trading Cassel and Vrabel for Peppers - not a bad deal - and would end up with either 23/34 + 47 and 58. Add in Leigh Bodden and maybe Sean Jones and a JAG WR, and we would be in amazing shape going into the draft.

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

HEY BRO! WHAT UP? said:

The reason why we are mad is because there are many teams out there with plenty of cap room and no QB. So you're telling me that a team like Tampa Bay with 60 million in cap room with the 20th overall selection and no QB didn't want to trade for Matt Cassel? In fact, the Chiefs were the only team that would trade for Matt Cassel? How does Matt Shaub require more compensation to get him out of Atlanta than Matt Cassel. Complete bull****!

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yes atlanta got more compensation for schaub as did the eagels for feely to the fins. but there were two dumb gms at the other end of the deals .fact that this was pioli and the fact that feely and schaub arent exactly setting the league on fire made people wary about cassel in a new system outside of NE. how many times have players left NE and done well. that thinking coupled with it being a QB , couldve dettered teams. just guessing. past bad deals are precedent to what will happen now. Will pats give wilfork ,hayenes worth money for e.g ?

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

mayoclinic said:

I wonder if the Pats have something else up their sleeves - like #23 or #34 to Carolina for Peppers? In that case we would essentially be trading Cassel and Vrabel for Peppers - not a bad deal - and would end up with either 23/34 + 47 and 58. Add in Leigh Bodden and maybe Sean Jones and a JAG WR, and we would be in amazing shape going into the draft.

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Thoughts such as this are the only thing keeping me sane at the moment!

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

stcjones said:

I think that Pioli is looking like the genius that he is here......I think the Pats got a little impatient thinking that they may not be able to move Matt by the draft......and they let him go on the cheap.....Vrabs still has plenty left in the tank for the next couple of years and still had some value.....to let BOTH of them go simply for a second rounder is jaw dropping........Cassel should have been able to fetch a #1 I would think........all the talking heads had him getting a #1 pick..........go figure.....in BB we trust.....

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You are simply overvaluing Vrabel. He is 34 years old! He was quite a bit slower this past year and didn't make nearly the number of plays that we saw from him the 3-4 years prior to that. Fact is, the guy is likely in a steep decline. Now KC needs veteran leadership so they are willing to take on a guy who might only have one or two decent years left in him, but for most teams that isn't worth much. Like I said, if the Pats had traded Vrabel alone they probably would've gotten a 6th rounder for him.

As for Cassel, the Pats don't want to be stuck holding the bag on that one. My guess is that they felt out the other teams that might be interested, didn't think there was a huge market for him, and decided to move him at the first reasonable chance. That is a better strategy than holding on to a $14.6 million back-up, don't you agree?

Still, I do wish they had gotten a 2010 conditional pick thrown in...

Re: Adam Sch. reports : Matt Cassel to Chiefs ! [merged]

BB and PILOI GOT RIPPED!!!!! (wait, what?) Pioli works for the chiefs now?!?!?
Well then I guess this is how I would have expected it to go down

Re: Pats release on Cassel / Vrabel trade

On those who think we were hosed, please get back to me in August, or better yet in Febraury.

Let us then compare the 2009 and future value to the patriots of

1) Cassel and Vrabel

2) #34 and $17M of cap room

I think that you will find that we did just fine.