2014 Draft Prospect Thread

I'm a big fan of Ford and Attaochu. I think they are better then all of the 43 DEs excluding Clowney and Mack.

manxman2601 said:

But you can a 230lb linebacker?

Or a 280lb DT?

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Shazier's 237 lbs, thank you very much!

Yeah, it does give me pause. But I see signs that BB is looking toward a more athletic LB corps, and he's always liked the SS/LB hybrid. As for the DT...I assume you're talking about Donald? I really haven't bothered weighing in on him at all, since I assume he'll be long gone.

Critically, though: Donald and Shazier are both rare, spectacular athletes for their respective sizes. Ford just isn't at that level.

patchick said:

Shazier's 237 lbs, thank you very much!

Yeah, it does give me pause. But I see signs that BB is looking toward a more athletic LB corps, and he's always liked the SS/LB hybrid. As for the DT...I assume you're talking about Donald? I really haven't bothered weighing in on him at all, since I assume he'll be long gone.

Critically, though: Donald and Shazier are both rare, spectacular athletes for their respective sizes. Ford just isn't at that level.

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I agree about this. I'm just going on the tape and need on this one. Ford is the best pass rusher available to us, plays in the SEC, had a good 3 cone (important for a Patriot pass rusher) and we've worked him out. From that regard I like his value at 29. And I think another pass rusher has now become our biggest need. I'd still take Hageman, Shazier, ASJ and Tuitt ahead of him though.

manxman2601 said:

But you can a 230lb linebacker?

Or a 280lb DT?

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I'm really not convinced he would draft any of them in the first to be honest but think he would draft all of them in the second. The one thing about Donald vs Shazier or Ford is he's a nightmare matchup one on one. FSU had to double team him almost every play and when they didn't they paid for it. I thought they should have drafted Woodley and they traded out and he's much bigger than Ford and had similar workout numbers.

everlong said:

I'm really not convinced he would draft any of them in the first to be honest but think he would draft all of them in the second. The one thing about Donald vs Shazier or Ford is he's a nightmare matchup one on one. FSU had to double team him almost every play and when they didn't they paid for it. I thought they should have drafted Woodley and they traded out and he's much bigger than Ford and had similar workout numbers.

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It's like I said. I think pass rusher is arguably the biggest need right now and I think Dee Ford is the best available. My thinking doesn't go much further than that. There are certainly players I like more.

Just got round to watching some Dee Ford...the one word to describe him would be relentless.

Dee Ford is really last years Jaime Collins but faster wih 4.54 vs 4.64 40 yd dash time and with very similar size 6'2" 252 vs. 6'3" 250. If they take Dee Ford we get a tenacious type of player who could play both LB and DE which wouldn't surprise me because BB loves versatile players. Maybe one pick could fill two needs at both DE and LB. It wouldn't surprise me if the Pats picked him but they better go after a DT in the second round if they do.

rdf63 said:

Dee Ford is really last years Jaime Collins but faster 4.54 vs 4.64 40 yd dash time but with similar size 6'2" 252 vs. 6'3" 250. If they take Dee Ford are they getting a player they already have or could he be someone who could play both LB and DE which wouldn't surprise me because BB loves versatile players.

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He has nowhere near Collins' elite explosion numbers (35.5" vert, 10'4" broad for Ford, 41.5" vert, 11'7" broad for Collins).

The Pats may be hesitant to draft Ford in the 1st round because he had herniated disk and surgery. Back problems didn't stop the Pats from drafting Gronk but it may drop Ford into the 2nd round or possibly even lower.

rdf63 said:

Dee Ford is really last years Jaime Collins but faster wih 4.54 vs 4.64 40 yd dash time and with very similar size 6'2" 252 vs. 6'3" 250. If they take Dee Ford we get a tenacious type of player who could play both LB and DE which wouldn't surprise me because BB loves versatile players. Maybe one pick could fill two needs at both DE and LB. It wouldn't surprise me if the Pats picked him but they better go after a DT in the second round if they do.

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Ford worked out at 244 lbs at Auburn's pro day, not 252. And while he's slighty faster over 40 yards, Collins 10-yard split is much better (1.58 s vs 1.67 s). Collins' 20 yard shuttle is also much better (4.32 s vs 4.73 s). Ford only outperformed Collins in the bench press. In every other workout Collins was on par or much better.

Defsoul said:

Ford worked out at 244 lbs at Auburn's pro day, not 252. And while he's slighty faster over 40 yards, Collins 10-yard split is much better (1.58 s vs 1.67 s). Collins' 20 yard shuttle is also much better (4.32 s vs 4.73 s). Ford only outperformed Collins in the bench press. In every other workout Collins was on par or much better.

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I'm not too worried about the SS but that 10 yard split isn't great. Having said that, Chandler Jones' was 1.63 and Kony Ealy's best was 1.66.

One name to keep an eye out for is Laurent Duvernay-Tardif, a Canadian OT from McGill. He's getting a fair amount of buzz and played well at the East-West Shrine game. Put up over 30 on the VJ at his pro day and looked good.

Laurent Duvernay-Tardif pro day - YouTube

His highlight reel is short but oh so sweet.

Laurent Duvernay-Tardif Highlights - Hudl

Unfortunately we weren't one of the teams at his pro day and I've seen nothing to link us to him.

manxman2601 said:

It's like I said. I think pass rusher is arguably the biggest need right now and I think Dee Ford is the best available. My thinking doesn't go much further than that. There are certainly players I like more.

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You're absolutely correct IMO that pass rush is a huge need but we could improve our pass rush by simply drafting a DE to take snaps from jones/Nink on 1st and 2nd down. We don't have to necessarily draft a great pass rusher. Shot, Armstead could already be that player.

Coach42 said:

You're absolutely correct IMO that pass rush is a huge need but we could improve our pass rush by simply drafting a DE to take snaps from jones/Nink on 1st and 2nd down. We don't have to necessarily draft a great pass rusher. Shot, Armstead could already be that player.

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I'd be fine with adding Tuitt to Armstead and having them share DE duties as well as adding DT capability. It's certainly a much more versatile option and Tuitt has shown the ability to rush the passer from the End.

I really like Jeremiah Attaochu. He has some issues to work on but he can get after the QB, has a great first step and plays with a physical relentless style.

Had some pretty good pro day numbers. Ran a 4.57, 37.5 vert, 1.55 ten yard split. 3 cone was a bit slower than the Pats like at 7.28 though. I'd love to pick him up ay 62.

1st round pick I like Stephon Tuitt or Deone Buccanon.


Both will at least be solid NFL players with Pro Bowl ceilings. You can't ask for much more from a late rd 1st.

manxman2601 said:

He has nowhere near Collins' elite explosion numbers (35.5" vert, 10'4" broad for Ford, 41.5" vert, 11'7" broad for Collins).

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Yup Collins is an absolute freak/beast athlete. Not many will measure up to those numbers. He basically has jump out of the gym athleticism. I mean just look at the pics:







Just ridiculous!

So... um I guess we need to set our expectations lower if we are going to realistic about who we're getting at #29.

I've got a quick question what happened to Jonathan Brown OLB Illinois, I believe he was a 1st round talent early in the year, even predicted at #20 and now he's a potential UDFA pickup any one know why he dropped so much or maybe why he was ranked so high in the first place?

rdf63 said:

Dee Ford is really last years Jaime Collins but faster wih 4.54 vs 4.64 40 yd dash time and with very similar size 6'2" 252 vs. 6'3" 250. If they take Dee Ford we get a tenacious type of player who could play both LB and DE which wouldn't surprise me because BB loves versatile players. Maybe one pick could fill two needs at both DE and LB. It wouldn't surprise me if the Pats picked him but they better go after a DT in the second round if they do.

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manxman2601 said:

He has nowhere near Collins' elite explosion numbers (35.5" vert, 10'4" broad for Ford, 41.5" vert, 11'7" broad for Collins).

Click to expand...

Defsoul said:

Ford worked out at 244 lbs at Auburn's pro day, not 252. And while he's slighty faster over 40 yards, Collins 10-yard split is much better (1.58 s vs 1.67 s). Collins' 20 yard shuttle is also much better (4.32 s vs 4.73 s). Ford only outperformed Collins in the bench press. In every other workout Collins was on par or much better.

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VJCPatriot said:

Yup Collins is an absolute freak/beast athlete. Not many will measure up to those numbers. He basically has jump out of the gym athleticism.

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It's interesting that Dee Ford's defensive coordinator last year was Ellis Johnson, who was Jamie Collins' head coach the year before. Before that he was the defensive coordinator at South Carolina for 4 years where he coached Melvin Ingram, Devin Taylor, and even Jadeveon Clowney as a freshman. Johnson is best known for running a 4-2-5 base defense. He moved Collins from LB to the "bandit" role as a hybrid DE/OLB in 2012. Ford basically played that role for Auburn last year.

Breaking down Auburn's 4-2-5 defense: Defensive ends | AL.com
The Auburn Plainsman

Also, FWIW, a guy to keep an eye on for 2015 is Justin Garrett (6'1" 218#) who plays the "star" hybrid LB/S role in Johnson's 4-2-5 base, which was designed to combat no-huddle and spread offenses and to allow for flexible formation changes without changing personnel:

Ellis Johnson outlines the philosophy behind Auburn's 4-2-5 defense | AL.com
http://www.auburntigers.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/072213aaf.html

The basic goals of the 4-2-5 are simple: Eliminate the need for full-formation adjustments, limit substitutions and get players on the field who can handle speed on the edge.

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Sound familiar?

Garrett missed much of 2013 with a foot injury, but he'll be an interesting guy to follow this year.

mayoclinic said:

It's interesting that Dee Ford's defensive coordinator last year was Ellis Johnson, who was Jamie Collins' head coach the year before. Before that he was the defensive coordinator at South Carolina for 4 years where he coached Melvin Ingram, Devin Taylor, and even Jadeveon Clowney as a freshman. Johnson is best known for running a 4-2-5 base defense. He moved Collins from LB to the "bandit" role as a hybrid DE/OLB in 2012. Ford basically played that role for Auburn last year.

Breaking down Auburn's 4-2-5 defense: Defensive ends | AL.com
The Auburn Plainsman

Also, FWIW, a guy to keep an eye on for 2015 is Justin Garrett (6'1" 218#) who plays the "star" hybrid LB/S role in Johnson's 4-2-5 base, which was designed to combat no-huddle and spread offenses and to allow for flexible formation changes without changing personnel:

Ellis Johnson outlines the philosophy behind Auburn's 4-2-5 defense | AL.com
4-2-5: Playing defense the Ellis Johnson way at Auburn - AuburnTigers.com - Official Athletics Site of the Auburn Tigers

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Double like!
This is what makes scouting prospects from Youtube so difficult. Understanding of schemes and asignments makes all the difference in evaluating the good from the bad.