Is the current OL lineup fine for 2015?

LOL @ "John Hannah."

Per some other posts here... yes, we will absolutely see where the value is by the NE brain trust's reckoning. And I hate to repeat the mantra, but after 4 SBs in 14 years, can I just throw out the off-season's first "In Bill We Trust"?

that very well might be the starting lineup but they definitely need to upgrade both guard positions in this years draft.

PATS16N0 said:

Brady has no rival (never mind equal) against even the toughest defense when he has time. With that in mind, any upgrades on the offensive line would be welcome ones. Give Tom 4 seconds in the pocket and nobody is safe from a 60 burger, and 19-0 is a real possibility next year considering how weak our schedule looks

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I honestly think that with this year under his belt, BB is going to be thinking "give him 3 seconds instead of 2.5"... the years of chasing 60 burgers and 19-0 (to me) seem over.

We've got a tilt toward defense and running game (aka offensive balance) being the hallmark of this last year -- and to put a fine point on it, versatility. If you have a weak secondary or no rush, we'll take shots downfield. If the underneath is your vulnerability, we'll find it.

I don't think either Bill or Tom liked having to make that happen in 2.5 seconds, and I am sure OL will be a draft-day priority (unless it isn't, of course.)

But my main thing is, you can't have everything. Brady can't get the optimal time-in-pocket, and we can still win. Darth Belichick will not forget this, cruel as it sounds. TFB got his years of pretty good protection where the assumption was that it's all on his arm.

I think that end of the equation starts to tend down toward the game Brady started with, the short and intermediate routes. We stop chasing the dragon of the downfield lightning strike. Econo-receivers, not econo-secondary. The Revis effect.

All that said, whatever you can get in the draft is cheap, right? So I won't be too surprised if we pick a high lineman. It's all about what's there when, and how the Pats have their draft board set up. (BTW... the answer is nothing like some pre-draft special or some "guide to the draft" you pick up at CVS).

PatsFanInVa said:

can I just throw out the off-season's first "In Bill We Trust"?

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Yes. It will be "In Bill We Trust" until the draft when "he has to prove he is the smartest guy in the room"(at least that's what the chicken littles and contrarians will say) and doesn't draft people's binkies.

JMC00 said:

Belichick just doesn't value a G in that spot and thinks he can get a guy that could be just as good a round later. Although maybe now that his LG is a free agent that opinion has changed.

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That must be why the Patriots have never drafted a G in the first round ... oh, wait.

JMC00 said:

Yes. It will be "In Bill We Trust" until the draft when "he has to prove he is the smartest guy in the room"(at least that's what the chicken littles and contrarians will say) and doesn't draft people's binkies.

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I love this stuff in the off season. We're now up to 4 out of 14 SBs, 6 SBs we've played in, what 8? AFCCGs... how the hell do people think this is happening if we don't know how to draft?

Don't get me started

Fencer said:

That must be why the Patriots have never drafted a G in the first round ... oh, wait.

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I suppose I could go over to the draft board and ask. Do you think that there are any guards in the 2015 draft that Belichick would draft in the first round? And yes, I think that the patriots could draft an OT, as they did when they drafted Mankins. My guess that unless there was a need at OT, this wouldn't happen.

mgteich said:

I suppose I could go over to the draft board and ask. Do you think that there are any guards in the 2015 draft that Belichick would draft in the first round? And yes, I think that the patriots could draft an OT, as they did when they drafted Mankins. My guess that unless there was a need at OT, this wouldn't happen.

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Actually I believe BB has a history of drafting OTs that are considered to be too short to play OT in the NFL, but have quick feet and make good guards.

The Gr8est said:

Actually I believe BB has a history of drafting OTs that are considered to be too short to play OT in the NFL, but have quick feet and make good guards.

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I understand and agree. The best college prospect for LG is often someone who is an LT in college. Please note that Mankins actually played some LT for us when there was an injury. Mankins was a top LG, but also an emergency backup LT.

I mentioned drafting an OT because it is indeed possible, for me more likely in the second round than in the first.

For me, it seems likely that we will trade down unless we find a worthy DT.

mgteich said:

I suppose I could go over to the draft board and ask. Do you think that there are any guards in the 2015 draft that Belichick would draft in the first round? And yes, I think that the patriots could draft an OT, as they did when they drafted Mankins. My guess that unless there was a need at OT, this wouldn't happen.

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They were reported to have spent quite a lot of time with TJ Clemmings at the Senior Bowl. BB likes his athletic and physical freaks in the first round and Clemmings certainly fits that mould. He probably won't fall to us though.

manxman2601 said:

They were reported to have spent quite a lot of time with TJ Clemmings at the Senior Bowl. BB likes his athletic and physical freaks in the first round and Clemmings certainly fits that mould. He probably won't fall to us though.

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No worries.... Once Goodell hands down his punishment for the Jets tampering, the Patriots will have a top 10 pick in the first round of the draft.

Problem solved.







Right, Rodger?

manxman2601 said:

They were reported to have spent quite a lot of time with TJ Clemmings at the Senior Bowl. BB likes his athletic and physical freaks in the first round and Clemmings certainly fits that mould. He probably won't fall to us though.

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Maybe we'll trade up.

I am not normally a proponent of this, but BB did it recently with Jones and Hightower and it worked out well.

We will have some untradeable picks like the comp for Talib, so I can certainly see trading up in the 1st a few spots to get someone we really want.

We just won the Superbowl. If we sign the FAs that we need to, then there are not that many roster spots available any way, and BB does well enough on UDFAs that extra picks aren't the priority that they are for other teams.

That doesn't even consider picks we might get from other teams once the Rats tampering and Deflategate investigations are completed.

mgteich said:

I understand and agree. The best college prospect for LG is often someone who is an LT in college. Please note that Mankins actually played some LT for us when there was an injury. Mankins was a top LG, but also an emergency backup LT.

I mentioned drafting an OT because it is indeed possible, for me more likely in the second round than in the first.

For me, it seems likely that we will trade down unless we find a worthy DT.

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Right. A "guard" is often a college LT. We can still talk about drafting guards.

That said,

• Mankins was never seriously considered as a starter other than at guard.
• The Cannon to guard experiment was half-hearted and unsuccessful.
• We don't know either way yet on Fleming.

Only draft an interior OL who has at least a 38" vert. Isn't that what we always do? IIRC that was the popular belief last year.

Nothing better than having a starting offensive line guard who can lead the NBA in rebounding, right?

I always want the best linemen on either side of the ball. Always.

That said, BB will trade down from 32 and go with best available player with the 2d round pick. He will pick up at least two picks for 2017.

Plus the Pats will be awarded the Colts' first round picks through the end of the decade for the Deflategate fraud.

The Gr8est said:

Maybe we'll trade up.

I am not normally a proponent of this, but BB did it recently with Jones and Hightower and it worked out well.

We will have some untradeable picks like the comp for Talib, so I can certainly see trading up in the 1st a few spots to get someone we really want.

We just won the Superbowl. If we sign the FAs that we need to, then there are not that many roster spots available any way, and BB does well enough on UDFAs that extra picks aren't the priority that they are for other teams.

That doesn't even consider picks we might get from other teams once the Rats tampering and Deflategate investigations are completed.

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If he falls into the twenties then I'm definitely on board with that. He's my second favourite 'gettable' prospect in the draft.

OhExaulted1 said:

Only draft an interior OL who has at least a 38" vert. Isn't that what we always do? IIRC that was the popular belief last year.

Nothing better than having a starting offensive line guard who can lead the NBA in rebounding, right?

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Thanks for that straw man argument. The mark was 30", I was wrong that the vert was necessarily that important, now how about moving on.

patsinthesnow said:

Connolly is a FA and probably could be resigned for cheap.

Solder - Connolly - Stork - Wendell - Vollmer

That OL combination gave Brady enough time to carve up the 3 of the best defenses in the NFL (Bills, Lions, Seahawks). They also stonewalled the Broncos/Ravens pass rushers.

Is OL really a need? Vollmer returned to All-Pro form this year, Stork looks like a future 10 year starter at C, and Solder pulled his head out of his @$$ after the Chargers game. Our guards aren't anything special but does upgrading them really warrant a 1st or 2nd round pick?

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No we need to upgrade our guards. Fleming could slide in at RG, which is my hope but we need to draft a LG who can be a day 1 starter.

We need an infusion of size and talent at OG, though I underestimated Wendell. Plucky, smart, tough guy. I think we were looking at LSU's Trai Turner in the third round last year, but Carolina took the 6'3' 311-pounder just before we picked. If I'm right, that may be why we traded out of that spot.


Nepatriotsdraft has an entry for a doppelganger of Turner, who started for the Panthers after recovering from injuries, in South Carolina's A.J. Cann. Check it out. I love the idea of using a third-rounder on a guard.

But, Wendell, I owe you an apology for doubting your ability to get the job done. You played better in the SB than Logan Mankins did for us. Inexplicably, Mankins saved his worst games for the biggest stage. The 2008 SB he was horrendous, worst game of his career probably.

Yes, we need a starting and backup LG. Connolly or another veteran should make the 53 in addition to two youngsters who can replace Devey and Kline on the roster.

Obviously, it would be great to get a draftee who could win the starting LG position. But, I am more than fine if we can get a LG in training who can start in 2016.