Montana's perfect Super Bowls in perspective

This is what I posted in another thread corcerning Montana vs Brady in the postseason only:

In 2008, Brady was on the shelf
In 2009, Brady was coming back from his ACL injury, and was not 100%
In 2010, Moss was clearly in decline, and was traded away


In 2007, the only season that a healthy Brady has had an elite OWR, Tom Brady set the single season record for the most TD passes by a QB, and helped Randy Moss set the single season record for most TD passes by a WR.

It would have been great to have a few more seasons with those to together, healthy, and still in their prime. The Brady/Manning/Montana comparisons would then have been on more even footing.

Here is the end of the argument.

If we consider either going to the SB or going one and done that encompasses 8 seasons for each.
In addition Montana had 3 other seasons where he won at least one game but did not get to the SB, Brady 4, so those are basically a wash for this discussion.

In those 8 seasons
Brady 4 Championships
Montana 4 Championships

Brady 2 one and dones; 2 seasons winning twice, getting to SB and losing.
Montana 4 one and dones.

In the comparable seasons where Brady lost the SB, Montana was one and done.
That is the only fact needed to dismiss the 4-0 in SBs is better than 4-2.

you can't take away what he did 4 SB's and 0 INT's but no one remembers how good the 49ers were as a team with Montana in three of the for SB's they played they were not the best offense on the field and the 49ers did not become a offensive power house until Steve young took over as the starter,

even Brady's pre 2007 numbers were better then Montana and with less talent to work with. and for the people that say it was a different era yes it was there were not 10 QB's a year throwing for 4000 yards like today but its not like it was not being done guys like Dan Fouts. marino, Kelly and Elway were putting up the 30 TD 4000 yard seasons

Even though there is no doubt in my mind about who is greater (including for reasons cited by others above), we can't escape the reality that the Brady v. Montana discussion is one that will go on for years, unless TB puts an end to it once and for all by picking up his fifth ring (see my new signature line).

For now, the most interesting thing from my perspective is that the discussion of the GOAT can no longer reasonably include consideration of P. Manning.

I've been following the NFL long enough to remember, as I noted somewhere else out here, that there was a time when people debated whether Marino or Montana was the greater QB. That is a discussion that has not been carried on in a serious manner by knowledgeable observers for almost 20 years. Because he is still around, die-hard supporters of Manning will continue to interject his name into the GOAT discussion. But it is only a matter of time before, like Marino, he is dropped from the conversation.

Like I said before. Montana was always regarded as the supreme QB because of the hardware. But now because media darling Manning has the Marino type stats, the goal posts have been moved as to what matters in the GOAT QB discussion.

TB gets his 5th and they will come up with some new ********. Trust me.

FourierSeries said:

Montana had a couple of embarrassing showings against the Giants in the playoffs. Brady at least looked competitive against them. Can't fault Brady for being in a different conference and having to play them in the SB as opposed to earlier in the postseason.

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I can watch your Sig over and over

Now that the argument is over, here's the sideline conversation in the off-season...

BB: "Brady-Montana. <snort> Only one way to get past those losses."
TFB: "That's why you'll never be a..."
BB: "Grapes! Take some reps over here!"
TFB: [Facepalm]

Brady and Montana are the 2 best modern era QB's, and no one else is in the conversation. Now most of us never witnessed Johnny U or Otto Graham play and it was such a different game back then that it really isn't fair to compare them to the modern players.

I can see why people still think the best is Joe. 4 for 4 and no Super Bowl picks is pretty impressive. But he also had the best receiver of all time in a few of those Super Bowls and he had a stacked team on both O and D. Brady has played in tougher era to keep teams/talent together. He's done more with less. The only constant has been him and Belichick. He's been great for a longer period of time then Joe was.

I can see the argument on both sides but for me Brady has won in a tougher era to win and has done at high level for longer then anyone else. Brady's the best.

robertweathers said:

I don't understand your OP. What is your point?

Montana won 4 Super Bowls vs good teams and won 4 NFCCG vs very good competition. They certainly did not play competition at the level of the 08 Lions...

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Yeah, plus the fact that the 2007 Giants were - by a healthy margin - the worst team NE faced in the SB. And the 2011 Giants were arguably the second worst.

I don't know, it's a tough call.

One guy broke records, won more games, went to more Super Bowls, and did it in the cold weather, under a salary cap, with only 1 HOF WR for 2 years.

The other guy spent 14 years in fair weather chucking balls at his stickum covered HOF WR on a team stacked with talent who couldn't leave for free agency.

Tough call.

FibSeq13478 said:

The most challenging game during that stretch was the NFC championship game not the Super Bowl.

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The second Bengals matchup was not easy in the least, with Boomer Esiason playing at an MVP level and that Ickey Woods/James Brooks/Stanley Wilson backfield running behind Munoz at his peak, certainly one of the best 3-4 offensive tackles in NFL history.

Of course fullback Wilson going on a coke binge the night before the game didn't help.

Oswlek said:

Yeah, plus the fact that the 2007 Giants were - by a healthy margin - the worst team NE faced in the SB. And the 2011 Giants were arguably the second worst.

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I think the 07 team had a better D/pass rush and running game and the 11 team had a better passing game. In the end, neither team will every be in the discussion of GoAT.

Palm Beach Pats Fan said:

The second Bengals matchup was not easy in the least, with Boomer Esiason playing at an MVP level and that Ickey Woods/James Brooks/Stanley Wilson backfield running behind Munoz at his peak, certainly one of the best 3-4 offensive tackles in NFL history.

Of course fullback Wilson going on a coke binge the night before the game didn't help.

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That was a very talented Bungles team.

In addition, if Tim Krumrie hasn't snapped his leg in half in the 1st 1/2 I wonder if things end differently as he was their best defensive player.

One thing for sure no quarterback in history has more Super Bowl rings and Super Bowl MVP or won more playoff games than Brady.Most importantly no pat fans fear Montana anymore. Brady with his current stats is good enough to go against any quarterback in NFL history.

The whole "4-0 in SuperBowls" is such a deceiving stat (at least when you compare it to 4-2)

Only simple minded losers will try to use that stat in a debate

08 lions comparison is ******ed.

it's more like 14 colts. maybe even tebow's broncos many times. i watched that slaughter against elway's broncos many times (my pop is a niners fan) and the talent gap was ridiculous. seriously that elway's team didn't belong on the same field.

Brady has been to SB's in 6 of his 13 seasons as a starter.

That. Is. Re. Freaking. Diculous.

It is hard to wrap my brain around how good that is.

Has anyone else gone to so many SBs in 13 seasons?

The Gr8est said:

For perspective may want to 'sticky' this thread.

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Unless I'm mistaken, wouldn't a football that had been exposed to Stickum also be easier for Montana to grip?