Belichick signed to long term contract

[Satchboogie3]

Forget the BB/Brady stuff. He drafted, developed, coached, and surrounded hm the Grade A talent for 20 years. Too minimize that is BS,

The issue is he the right guy for the job at hand right now.

He was drafted in the 6th round. Bill had no idea Brady was going to turn into a serviceable QB, let alone the GOAT, or why would he have waited until the 6th? How many of 'his guys' has he reached and drafted way higher than needed?

Developed - I'd argue the development was almost all Charlie Weis/McDaniels plus his QB guru Martinez.

Coached - As above, the offense was Weis and McDaniels, not really Bill's

Grade A talent - What talent? He had B talent at best in the early years. 1 great year from Dillon. Troy was a solid player, but only once a pro-bowler. Branch was solid, but not pro-bowl caliber and did nothing post-Patriots. And of course 06 was a disaster when they let him leave and Troy was 35. Reche Caldwell and Ben Watson were the leading receivers... Then 07 Bill had to address the WR situation by rolling the dice on Moss and Stallworth. Welker no one knew was going to become a pro-bowl slot receiver, that was largely Brady, same as with Edelman. Bill didn't have some genius plan to draft Edelman was the Welker replacement and I again don't think Edelman becomes a Patriots star without Brady. Gronk and Hernandez were basically it. How many bad FA signings did bill make just being reactionary to the lack of quality and depth, Ocho Cinco, Joey Galloway, Brandon Loyd, bringing Stallworth back for a year, Lafell, Sanu, AB, and mostly due to terrible drafting. And even when they did bring in a solid receiver like Lafell and Cooks, Bill had them gone after a year, it was a revolving door.

 

[Satchboogie3]

You forgot Deion Branch.

Deion Branch a grade A talent . Never made a pro-bowl, never hit 1000 yds in a season, only once had more than 5 TDs. Averaged 47 rec, 604yds, 3.5 TDs per season. He was a solid B level receiver, in no world is he a 'grade A' talent.

 

[RobertWeathers]

He was drafted in the 6th round. Bill had no idea Brady was going to turn into a serviceable QB, let alone the GOAT, or why would he have waited until the 6th? How many of 'his guys' has he reached and drafted way higher than needed?

Developed - I'd argue the development was almost all Charlie Weis/McDaniels plus his QB guru Martinez.

Coached - As above, the offense was Weis and McDaniels, not really Bill's

Grade A talent - What talent? He had B talent at best in the early years. 1 great year from Dillon. Troy was a solid player, but only once a pro-bowler. Branch was solid, but not pro-bowl caliber and did nothing post-Patriots. And of course 06 was a disaster when they let him leave and Troy was 35. Reche Caldwell and Ben Watson were the leading receivers... Then 07 Bill had to address the WR situation by rolling the dice on Moss and Stallworth. Welker no one knew was going to become a pro-bowl slot receiver, that was largely Brady, same as with Edelman. Bill didn't have some genius plan to draft Edelman was the Welker replacement and I again don't think Edelman becomes a Patriots star without Brady. Gronk and Hernandez were basically it. How many bad FA signings did bill make just being reactionary to the lack of quality and depth, Ocho Cinco, Joey Galloway, Brandon Loyd, bringing Stallworth back for a year, Lafell, Sanu, AB, and mostly due to terrible drafting. And even when they did bring in a solid receiver like Lafell and Cooks, Bill had them gone after a year, it was a revolving door.

I said defense as well. Perhaps you missed that.

You're right. BB doesn't deserve any credit at all.

Somehow they won 6 Super Bowls with this second-tier talent on the roster.

Deion Branch a grade A talent . Never made a pro-bowl, never hit 1000 yds in a season, only once had more than 5 TDs. Averaged 47 rec, 604yds, 3.5 TDs per season. He was a solid B level receiver, in no world is he a 'grade A' talent.

They don't win 2 Super Bowls without him.

Grade A doesn't mean having great stats but having great games when they matter.

 

[Satchboogie3]

I said defense as well. Perhaps you missed that.

You're right. BB doesn't deserve any credit at all.

What does defense have to do to responding to your claim that Bill deserves credit because 'He drafted, developed, coached, and surrounded hm the Grade A talent for 20 years.'

Somehow they won 6 Super Bowls with this second-tier talent on the roster.

Yeah, because they had Tom Brady. Guess what, now they don't, they are finding out that an offense with a bunch of scrubs can't actually be competitive. This isn't new either, I remember comments leaking in the past that the coaching staff believed they could win with any top 15 QB. That's looking pretty ridiculous now.

They don't win 2 Super Bowls without him.
Grade A doesn't mean having great stats but having great games when they matter.

That's literally no one's definition of grade A. No doubt Branch had some big games in the playoffs. So did Hogan, yet I don't think anyone is going to claim he's a grade A talent.

 

[RobertWeathers]

What does defense have to do to responding to your claim that Bill deserves credit because 'He drafted, developed, coached, and surrounded hm the Grade A talent for 20 years.'

You can't build Super Bowl teams without having talent on the other side of the football. Putting all of your talent on offense and no on defense is reckless and doesn't do a franchise QB any favors.

Yeah, because they had Tom Brady. Guess what, now they don't, they are finding out that an offense with a bunch of scrubs can't actually be competitive. This isn't new either, I remember comments leaking in the past that the coaching staff believed they could win with any top 15 QB. That's looking pretty ridiculous now.

They also had top players on offense. What we have in 2023 (...and 2022, 2021, 2020) is a complete lack of playmakers and players which threaten defenses....maybe Rham with a solid o-line?

That's literally no one's definition of grade A. No doubt Branch had some big games in the playoffs. So did Hogan, yet I don't think anyone is going to claim he's a grade A talent.

I disagree with them. Give me a player who raises their game in the playoffs over a regular season stat chaser anytime.

 

[Satchboogie3]

You can't build Super Bowl teams without having talent on the other side of the football. Putting all of your talent on offense and no on defense is reckless and doesn't do a franchise QB any favors.

No one has said the Pats should only load up on the offense. The complaint is Bill has done a terrible job of providing the offense with talented skill-position players over the years. A few exceptions doesn't prove the rule.

I don't disagree that the last few years have been as bad as ever, this year might be the worst.

I disagree with them. Give me a player who raises their game in the playoffs over a regular season stat chaser anytime.

Another strawman. No one is arguing for 'stat chasers' over big playoff performers. Solid players can step up, that doesn't make them better talent or a better player. It's also not a knock on Branch. Edelman wasn't a grade A talent. That doesn't mean he wasn't valuable or worth having. It just means he was never one of the best receivers in the game.

 

[RobertWeathers]

No one has said the Pats should only load up on the offense. The complaint is Bill has done a terrible job of providing the offense with talented skill-position players over the years. A few exceptions doesn't prove the rule.

Part of it was by design because he didn't need to but to say Tom didn't have top -tier talent to work with over his career is wrong.

I don't disagree that the last few years have been as bad as ever, this year might be the worst.

Another strawman. No one is arguing for 'stat chasers' over big playoff performers. Solid players can step up, that doesn't make them better talent or a better player. It's also not a knock on Branch. Edelman wasn't a grade A talent. That doesn't mean he wasn't valuable or worth having. It just means he was never one of the best receivers in the game.

It's not a strawman. I put Branch in that category. Same goes for JE and Welker. You don't and thats fine.

 

[XLIX]

I disagree with them. Give me a player who raises their game in the playoffs over a regular season stat chaser anytime.

You can't raise you game in the playoffs when your team fails to make the playoffs. Patriots players may as well schedule their tee times for January 8.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

-

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

a

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

You forgot Deion Branch.

....and defense counts too.

If Tom doesn't have a defense finish in the top 10 in points allowed almost every year he doesn't win 7 Super Bowls. Instead he's Dan Marino.

Name other franchises to have that kind of talent and production between 2002 and 2018.

Every team has "luck" drafting players.

Actually the team started out on defense thanks to the incredible drafting talents of Bill Parcells who put the nucleus of the studs on the field pre-2000 and all the team needed back then was a HOF QB to complete the puzzle and a few good free agent pickups - And Deion Branch was a decent receiver but to put him at Grade A level is laughable ....put the bottle down dude

 

[RobertWeathers]

Actually the team started out on defense thanks to the incredible drafting talents of Bill Parcells who put the nucleus of the studs on the field pre-2000 and all the team needed back then was a HOF QB to complete the puzzle and a few good free agent pickups - And Deion Branch was a decent receiver but to put him at Grade A level is laughable ....put the bottle down dude

Another "Bill doesn't deserve credit" clown....

Considering you have 2 other posts with nothing said except a single character...perhaps you should put the bottle down or whatever else you consume.

 

[RobertWeathers]

You can't raise you game in the playoffs when your team fails to make the playoffs. Patriots players may as well schedule their tee times for January 8.

OK?

 

[Ring 6]

You can't raise you game in the playoffs when your team fails to make the playoffs. Patriots players may as well schedule their tee times for January 8.

I love how we have so many fans proud to announce the team is losing.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Another "Bill doesn't deserve credit" clown....

Considering you have 2 other posts with nothing said except a single character...perhaps you should put the bottle down or whatever else you consume.

there isnt a way i've seen to delete posts once it goes on thus the weird single posts stayed

 

[RobertWeathers]

there isnt a way i've seen to delete posts once it goes on thus the weird single posts stayed

I apologize. Seems one can't.

That's silly. I figured Ian would want posters to have that feature. At least make the timeout longer.....

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

I apologize. Seems one can't.

That's silly. I figured Ian would want posters to have that feature. At least make the timeout longer.....

I couldn't find one way to do it - never could for years

 

[sb1]

I apologize. Seems one can't.

That's silly. I figured Ian would want posters to have that feature. At least make the timeout longer.....

I've had a few . posts myself.

I guess we could report our own posts? Not sure if that would work. Hope Ian doesnt make us pay $8 and get a checkmark to delete our posts

 

[RobertWeathers]

I've had a few . posts myself.

I guess we could report our own posts? Not sure if that would work. Hope Ian doesnt make us pay $8 and get a checkmark to delete our posts

That or we can always say someone hacked into our PFs account and posted crap we never said.

 

[sb1]

Actually the team started out on defense thanks to the incredible drafting talents of Bill Parcells who put the nucleus of the studs on the field pre-2000 and all the team needed back then was a HOF QB to complete the puzzle and a few good free agent pickups - And Deion Branch was a decent receiver but to put him at Grade A level is laughable ....put the bottle down dude

That's what Tuna does best... build. He's a better builder than coach.