Patriots currently projected to finish last in AFC East in 2023 by Vegas

[TheRainMaker]

If the Patriots do finish 4th I believe it’s the end of the road for BB here. For better or worse.

I don’t think we will.

Whether or not the Jets land Rodgers, Bill absolutely needs to go if the Pats finish 4th or has a losing record.

 

[Ian]

Whether or not the Jets land Rodgers, Bill absolutely needs to go if the Pats finish 4th or has a losing record.

That's sort of where my head is at. The Jets getting Rodgers aside, this needs to be a double-digit win team that shows improvement and is one that's in contention and playing next January, including advancing at least out of the Wild Card round. Obviously, context will be important, but I feel like there's some added pressure now to be significantly better based on what happened last year.

 

[Ian]

You know, this forum used to make fun of the teams who bragged about having "great offseasons".... Lord, how far we've fallen.....

It's a little different. We've been at this long enough to know big names often may not equal success. They need to shore up some key areas with solid players who may not even be flashy names, but at least guys who can get the job done and not make us talk about the lack of depth at their position after a given week. That in and of itself would be a win. Between that and another solid draft, it will at least be another step forward, with O'Brien and Klemm being the other X-factors.

 

[Triumph]

About this time in 2001, the very influential Pro Football Weekly's editor wrote an article listing the teams LEAST likely to get to a superbowl over the next 5 years. #1 on that list were the New England Patriots.

So, because tge

Who CARES about predictions that occur before FA and the draft. Who cares about prediction AFTER them. Listen, the Pats are going to be predicted to finish last in a VERY good division. It only makes sense. So would I, if I was forced to do so. But to get all upset and start bashing Bill (again) because of it is ridiculous. This fan base above every other SHOULD know how ludicrous these prognostications are, and take them all with a HUGE grain of

Sean McDermott took over as coach in 2017, Beane took over as GM. Instantly they won 9 games and went to the playoffs for the first time in 18 years. Tyrod Taylor was the QB, Josh Allen was nowhere to be found.

It generally takes 2-3 seasons for a new regime to fix cap issues and get all their players in place... to rebuild. Coaching and GM alone instantly made them better but it wasn’t simply the addition of Allen that made them contenders… he sucked for his first two seasons and they still made the playoffs. They also added Tremaine Edmunds, Poyer, Tredavious White, Diggs etc… exceptional players along with all the quality depth players who improved all three phases.

You only see the QB, it wasn’t one player, it was all the improvements.

2022 was not a normal season, BB made a massive error with his coaching staff. It was a vain idiotic mistake. They fixed that mistake. We’ll see what happens if they have another great offseason personnel wise. Coaching matters, one magic player doesn’t control an entire teams destiny.

BB is the next to hit the road.

 

[crawhammer]

Stating a fact, they have had good offseason's of late

Fact?

Belichick promoted Patrica to OC last offseason. Was that "good"?

Jonnu?
Agholor?

I'll just cut to the chase... what do they have to show for that $159.6 mil spending spree? I'll concede Judon. But the scoreboard says 18-17.

18 draft picks over the last two years. Good is probably a fair characterization at this point but the final grade is dependent on Mac Jones who many agree is entering a do or die season.

I haven't seen a requisite impact from that record setting spending spree. Still some questions about the draft picks, including the most important one. And last offseason gets a failing grade because one mind-numbing move may have trashed the entire season.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I’m warming up to trading down and drafting Herndon Hooker.

It is Hendon Hooker. We can trade down in the 1st for an additional 2nd, take an OT in the 1st, and then use the origjnal 2nd on a WR, and use the additional 2nd on Hooker.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Why is it always the same posters telling us, if this or that, BB will be the next to go?

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

Fact?

Belichick promoted Patrica to OC last offseason. Was that "good"?

Jonnu?
Agholor?

I'll just cut to the chase... what do they have to show for that $159.6 mil spending spree? I'll concede Judon. But the scoreboard says 18-17.

18 draft picks over the last two years. Good is probably a fair characterization at this point but the final grade is dependent on Mac Jones who many agree is entering a do or die season.

I haven't seen a requisite impact from that record setting spending spree. Still some questions about the draft picks, including the most important one. And last offseason gets a failing grade because one mind-numbing move may have trashed the entire season.

I think BB could put them in a better position to succeed if he would hire a full time experienced GM to work alongside him...like Pioli. Its hard to believe that he can do it all and do it well.

 

[Wozzy]

Fact?

Belichick promoted Patrica to OC last offseason. Was that "good"?

Jonnu?
Agholor?

I'll just cut to the chase... what do they have to show for that $159.6 mil spending spree? I'll concede Judon. But the scoreboard says 18-17.

18 draft picks over the last two years. Good is probably a fair characterization at this point but the final grade is dependent on Mac Jones who many agree is entering a do or die season.

I haven't seen a requisite impact from that record setting spending spree. Still some questions about the draft picks, including the most important one. And last offseason gets a failing grade because one mind-numbing move may have trashed the entire season.

I was talking strictly about player personnel... you know this because I already said Patricia was a colossal mistake.

The big spending spree in 2021 was because the cupboard was bare and the Pats made a decision to clear dead cap in 2020. The Patriots spent to the cap every season for two decades, the only thing that changed in 2021 was the amount of money they had to spend and available starting positions that needed to be filled. It's funny how you remember to mention Jonnu and Agholor but forget to mention Judon, Hunter Henry, Mills, Andrews, Godchaux, Bourne, Folk and others.

The Patriots had the most cap space in 2021, they have among the most in 2022 and 2023... they obviously didn't overspend or they wouldn't be so filthy f-ing rich right now.

 

[Marko]

What are the odds that Tua makes it through 5 games?

 

[Fatmancryin]

You say that, but then we don’t have a QB. For all the people who want to put everything on Zappe, the better option is to see who they put around Mac and how he fares while still having Zappe behind him. If Mac falters and Zappe surpasses him, you at least have Mac - a guy who has won in this league - as the backup . If you only have Zappe, and he gets hurt, they’re in trouble.

A 2nd and a 4th isn’t ridiculous enough for that risk. A first rounder is at least enticing. Otherwise, you’re getting two decent picks while still potentially creating another problem. They have the luxury of time with Zappe while Mac is in a year where he has to play well or it will potentially close the door on his time here.

Needless to say, let that one play out and you’ll get your answer either way. But making that move is just too big of a gamble. Or at least that’s my $.02.

I guess I don’t see it as that big of a risk in 2023 and possibly 2024. If the Raiders are willing to give something decent as I don’t

You say that, but then we don’t have a QB. For all the people who want to put everything on Zappe, the better option is to see who they put around Mac and how he fares while still having Zappe behind him. If Mac falters and Zappe surpasses him, you at least have Mac - a guy who has won in this league - as the backup . If you only have Zappe, and he gets hurt, they’re in trouble.

A 2nd and a 4th isn’t ridiculous enough for that risk. A first rounder is at least enticing. Otherwise, you’re getting two decent picks while still potentially creating another problem. They have the luxury of time with Zappe while Mac is in a year where he has to play well or it will potentially close the door on his time here.

Needless to say, let that one play out and you’ll get your answer either way. But making that move is just too big of a gamble. Or at least that’s my $.02.

I am willing to take that gamble. I think some seem to go back and think that the situation would turn into a year of Newton again and it very well might be, but we also saw that last year with Mac. Was the coaching staff a mess sure, but I also put blame on the players on the field.

As for trading Mac I say a 2-4 because I don’t think the raiders would give a 1st don’t think any team would at this point.

 

[Fatmancryin]

Either way, he’s what they have right now. Until a better option emerges - and keep in mind, as we saw with Brady, they’ll keep drafting QBs - you still need someone competent lining up under center on Sundays.

Right now, Mac and Zappe combined cost them less than one free agent. Barring someone offering something nuts, no reason to make a move until they have to.

Does it really matter that zappe and Mac cost less than one free agent if they aren’t going to use the savings to invest in the Offense.

 

[Fatmancryin]

Got a crystal ball, do you?

No just a snow globe.

 

[Fatmancryin]

He probably isn't, but he was absolutely screwed over by Bill in 2022. And now he has to pay for it as he is under pressure to have a good year so the Pats pick up his 5th year option. I would've liked to see someone more creative than Bill O'Brien, but it's better than nothing. I'd also like to see better talent surrounding Mac. Many people on here downplay how bad the talent around him really is.

I don’t disagree.

Can you honestly say even with Mcdaniels that you had faith and excitement that Mac was going to win you a game at any point in his 2 seasons?

As for talent surrounding Mac, absolutely the talent was bad around him, the coaching staff was horrible. We did see some of the same characteristics in Mac in year 1 and 2. The Patriots have proven that they aren’t going to invest big money on the offensive side with multiple playmakers.

 

[sb1]

I guess I don’t see it as that big of a risk in 2023 and possibly 2024. If the Raiders are willing to give something decent as I don’t


I am willing to take that gamble. I think some seem to go back and think that the situation would turn into a year of Newton again and it very well might be, but we also saw that last year with Mac. Was the coaching staff a mess sure, but I also put blame on the players on the field.

As for trading Mac I say a 2-4 because I don’t think the raiders would give a 1st don’t think any team would at this point.

You're probably right about that last point so why sell low on him now? Mac should get the opportunity to take the leap that he was supposed to take last year if the coaching didn't get screwed up.

 

[Steve102]

It's fekkin' March.

 

[Rob0729]

Why wouldn't they be predicted to finish last with the Jets likely to get Rodgers, but who gives a crap. We haven't even started the new league year. Vegas odds are going change wildly over the next six months while teams add and lose players.

 

[PatsFan2]

The current New England Patriots is Talent void let's not kid ourselves about that Fact. Plus many questions at the most important position QB. Yeah we are the Fourth best Team if the Jets land Rodgers...let's hope that doesn't happen.

 

[PatsFan2]

It's fekkin' March.

And the Patriots have more holes than Swiss cheese we are not Three players away. So the "it's just March crowd" better hope we hit on our FA and Draft acquisitions.

 

[JR52]

Why is it always the same posters telling us, if this or that, BB will be the next to go?

These same posters all seem to have a hard on for Mac Jones. But really guys, it's not related.