Reactions to “The Dynasty”

[FCB02062]

NBC Sports Boston is doing a "post game" show of the Dynasty with Phil Perry, Curran and Holley - it's pretty good because, like them or hate them, Curran and Holley were covering the team for the entire time. Their insight and commentary on the show is pretty cool. Last week they interviewed the producer, director, someone - I can't remember his title, but he was a big wig in the making of the series. One of the guys asked how they could completely gloss over, cutting Milloy, 03 and 04, back to back, 21 wins in a row, etc. The director dude said, and I'm paraphrasing, that if they showed stuff like Milloy release, the 03/04 wins, etc., then they would just be producing a "timeline" of events, but their goal was to tell a "story".
Of course, they want to tell a "story" because it gives them the most leeway to trash the team and pump up the sensation ********. Think about it, we're four episodes in and the overriding storylines they picked are Kraft "saving" the team, the improbable win in 01, snowbowl, tuck rule, brady/bledsoe, spygate, the FU 2007 tour, the loss to the NYG in 07. If the "stroy tellers" had any desire to step out of the area of yellow journalism they would've mentioned the dominance of the 03/04 run in much more depth and how the team bounced back from the 03 opener after the Milloy release.
One of the comments that left me scratching my head, and I think it was from Brady when he talked about losing the 06 afc title game in indianapolis. Brady said something to the affect of, "we didn't score enough points" - yes, that's obvious because they lost, but the insinuation was that the offense was subpar. Brady did not have a great game but they scored 34 points (7 on defense), which should be enough to win. There was no mention of how the defense simply collapsed in the second half or how there was supposedly a bad flu going through the defense and they ran out of gas. That's pertinent info because Brady continues to say had they won that game, they most likely win the SB.
Other misgivings I have is there is absolutely no mention of the 97-99 Pete Carroll teams. Yes, I know it's about the "dynasty" but those teams were not terrible (aside from the second half of the 99 season) and many of those players were on the team for the 01 SB. Also, I don't think there was any mention of the massive amount of Bill Parcells guys on the first three Super Bowl defenses. There is no credit given for Parcells drafting the core of the Super Bowl defenses.
I am curious to see how they handle the 2011 Super Bowl team. Will they cover the almost miraculous win over Baltimore in the AFC title game, a game in which many so-called experts picked Baltimore, complete with the legend of Myra Kraft blowing Tucker's game tying kick wide? Or will the focus be almost entirely on Aaron Hernandez? Will they mention the Welker drop, which if caught, totally changes the complexion of that game? Had footsie caught that ball, it's 1st and 10 inside the NYG 20 inside 4 minutes. Knowing Bill, he runs the ball 3 straight times, takes a delay on 4th, then kicks a FG, because he plays the clock all too often and not the scoreboard. So say they run 3 times up the gut and the NYG use their last remaining TO on defense plus the clock stops for the two minute warning....the Patriots, worst case, are kicking off up 20-15, if they run the play clock down to 0:01, take a delay on 4th down, then kick a 25 yarder if the previous three runs gain three yards total. They're kicking off with 35-45 seconds left and NYG have no timeouts.

 

[Steve102]

The NY Post apparently had a preview of episode 6, which deals with Aaron Hernandez. Apparently in the upcoming episode Jonathan Kraft will state that Belichick was reluctant to release Hernandez after his arrest and preferred to wait out the legal process.

Now, I'm waiting to see the actual episode and the exact way Jonathan Kraft was phrasing this before rendering any opinion as I don't exactly trust the NY Post on anything, but it is interesting that Jonathan Kraft wants to have this out there.

I guess as I am sitting here, a week before it comes out, I am thinking that yeah, sure, Bill sided with players and was loyal to the player until it came out that it was time to not be loyal to the player. That's on brand. He backs players.

 

[mike_usagisan]

I guess as I am sitting here, a week before it comes out, I am thinking that yeah, sure, Bill sided with players and was loyal to the player until it came out that it was time to not be loyal to the player. That's on brand. He backs players.

I wonder if they'll note the comparison to how it played out with ownership telling Bill to pull the plug quickly on AH as (supposedly) they also did with Antonio Brown.

 

[TheRainMaker]

NBC Sports Boston is doing a "post game" show of the Dynasty with Phil Perry, Curran and Holley - it's pretty good because, like them or hate them, Curran and Holley were covering the team for the entire time. Their insight and commentary on the show is pretty cool. Last week they interviewed the producer, director, someone - I can't remember his title, but he was a big wig in the making of the series. One of the guys asked how they could completely gloss over, cutting Milloy, 03 and 04, back to back, 21 wins in a row, etc. The director dude said, and I'm paraphrasing, that if they showed stuff like Milloy release, the 03/04 wins, etc., then they would just be producing a "timeline" of events, but their goal was to tell a "story".
Of course, they want to tell a "story" because it gives them the most leeway to trash the team and pump up the sensation ********. Think about it, we're four episodes in and the overriding storylines they picked are Kraft "saving" the team, the improbable win in 01, snowbowl, tuck rule, brady/bledsoe, spygate, the FU 2007 tour, the loss to the NYG in 07. If the "stroy tellers" had any desire to step out of the area of yellow journalism they would've mentioned the dominance of the 03/04 run in much more depth and how the team bounced back from the 03 opener after the Milloy release.
One of the comments that left me scratching my head, and I think it was from Brady when he talked about losing the 06 afc title game in indianapolis. Brady said something to the affect of, "we didn't score enough points" - yes, that's obvious because they lost, but the insinuation was that the offense was subpar. Brady did not have a great game but they scored 34 points (7 on defense), which should be enough to win. There was no mention of how the defense simply collapsed in the second half or how there was supposedly a bad flu going through the defense and they ran out of gas. That's pertinent info because Brady continues to say had they won that game, they most likely win the SB.
Other misgivings I have is there is absolutely no mention of the 97-99 Pete Carroll teams. Yes, I know it's about the "dynasty" but those teams were not terrible (aside from the second half of the 99 season) and many of those players were on the team for the 01 SB. Also, I don't think there was any mention of the massive amount of Bill Parcells guys on the first three Super Bowl defenses. There is no credit given for Parcells drafting the core of the Super Bowl defenses.
I am curious to see how they handle the 2011 Super Bowl team. Will they cover the almost miraculous win over Baltimore in the AFC title game, a game in which many so-called experts picked Baltimore, complete with the legend of Myra Kraft blowing Tucker's game tying kick wide? Or will the focus be almost entirely on Aaron Hernandez? Will they mention the Welker drop, which if caught, totally changes the complexion of that game? Had footsie caught that ball, it's 1st and 10 inside the NYG 20 inside 4 minutes. Knowing Bill, he runs the ball 3 straight times, takes a delay on 4th, then kicks a FG, because he plays the clock all too often and not the scoreboard. So say they run 3 times up the gut and the NYG use their last remaining TO on defense plus the clock stops for the two minute warning....the Patriots, worst case, are kicking off up 20-15, if they run the play clock down to 0:01, take a delay on 4th down, then kick a 25 yarder if the previous three runs gain three yards total. They're kicking off with 35-45 seconds left and NYG have no timeouts.

I haven't seen episodes 3 and 4 yet, but my nitpick with 1 and 2 is the teleporting and time traveling.

Hearing from posters they glossed over 2003 and the important trade of Corey Dillon in 2004 is bizarre as that move was the missing piece that put them over the top to repeat in 2004.

A definitive story of the dynasty would've been a timeline starting with the Parcells' years (particularly the 1996 draft). Many events had to happen for it to all fall into place. Break it up into seasons if they had to.

 

[Steve102]

I wonder if they'll note the comparison to how it played out with ownership telling Bill to pull the plug quickly on AH as (supposedly) they also did with Antonio Brown.

They'll gloss that over. Nothing to see here.

 

[ahmed]

Use your brain big dawg.

Kraft is distancing him self from Bill in this ****.

All I ever heard from Kraft was how Bill is the best ever and he would want no one else to coach the Patriots.

Now in 4 episodes I've heard him on no less than 3 times say Bill pissed him off with his on field decisions and even called him names for his supposed handling of spy gate.

As for producing. The whole thing was his pitch. I'm sure he had zero creative decisions and the whole documentary is completely unbiased. Right.

Glazer already had to field questions of editorial and journalist integrity BEFORE it was released because people were questioning the narrative of the documentary in pre press release tour.

What is inaccurate about that? It was reported back in 2007 that Kraft called Bill a schmuck when he asked him if there was material benefit to the taping and Bill said no.

I remember being very unhappy with Kraft that he said that in public (even though he was right since all that ****storm for something that was not even that useful) because you don't say that publicly especially back then when it was us against the world.

That was the first time and beginning of Kraft's imagine losing its shine in my mind. That said, it is very easy to understand there would be instances he would not see eye to eye with Bill after 20 years. Just because some blind homers think Bill was perfect does not mean everyone shared the same opinion.

He also gave Bill all the credit for sticking with Brady over Bledsoe. So not really sure what people's problem is with Kraft in this documentary except it shatters some of their fairy tale they have been in denial about since 2017 or so.

 

[festy1986]

What is inaccurate about that? It was reported back in 2007 that Kraft called Bill a schmuck when he asked him if there was material benefit to the taping and Bill said no.

I remember being very unhappy with Kraft that he said that in public (even though he was right since all that ****storm for something that was not even that useful) because you don't say that publicly especially back then when it was us against the world.

That was the first time and beginning of Kraft's imagine losing its shine in my mind. That said, it is very easy to understand there would be instances he would not see eye to eye with Bill after 20 years. Just because some blind homers think Bill was perfect does not mean everyone shared the same opinion.

He also gave Bill all the credit for sticking with Brady over Bledsoe. So not really sure what people's problem is with Kraft in this documentary except it shatters some of their fairy tale they have been in denial about since 2017 or so.

Did you expect for him not to give Bill credit for the very obvious things that worked out?

No one is out here saying that Bill got Brady over Drew wrong.

This isn't a ANTI Bill documentary.

It's a look at how awesome the team I lord over is documentary from the Krafts.

At the end of the day you get the feeling that every thing that Bill got right is Kraft doing because he hired him, he sought him out, he stuck with him and he empowered him.

That's the feeling because that's how Kraft sees it.

 

[venecol]

I think Perry/Curran said June-July of 23.

It took over 18 months just to get everyone on board, so the interviews probably spanned years. My guess they began this in 2020-21.

 

[Steve102]

It took over 18 months just to get everyone on board, so the interviews probably spanned years. My guess they began this in 2020-21.

They said that as well, but I think Bill specifically was what I said. I would have to go back and watch the podcast on youtube to confirm. Not that interested in the research TBH. I do want to listen to the breakdown of E3-4, which i will do tonight.

 

[SVN]

I wonder knowing this was coming out, how the kraft BB dynamic wouldve been if they had gone 9-8 or something and kept BB ? Or was it decided before hand to fire BB aligning with the timeline of this doc ?

 

[SammyBlueCat]

The episode about "Spy Gate" gave me a headache...

 

[1960Pats]

Sure, yeah, I will agree with that, but... Randy couldn't keep his head on straight. Can you imagine if you could combine the two? Randy's gifts with Jerry's ability to not self-sabotage? Wow.

I am amazed the guy was not run out of town. I refuse to click anything he writes and will not tune in to any broadcast, radio show, or podcast he's on. No sir.

Tomashole still sneaks up on me from time to time when I watch the boob tube.

Anyway, back to the show. It was funny seeing Tony Kornhole and Mike Wilbore talking nonsense about the Pats having no chance in SB 36 and that the only story was Drew vs Tom.

Every time I see that Silence of the Rams SB I can't help but think of what a great play JR Redman made when he gambled with a cutback. He barely made it OOB and they probably wouldn't have had time if they didn't get the call.

The 2007 season shots reminded me of the Pats being criticized for rubbing it in. Even the thought of that mentality in a pro game is laughable, even though it was true, especially when they played Joe Gibbs and the Redskins.

And the Snow Bowl kick by Vinatieri that tied the game is still the greatest kick in NYFL history.

 

[1960Pats]

Have you watched it? If so, what exactly wasn't portrayed accurately? Did you learn anything new from the interviews?

I learned that I wouldn't want to have had a private conversation with Bob Kraft only to see it told to the world.

You know I'm not Bill's biggest fan but Kraft is coming across as ungrateful for what Bill accomplished here and he seems to be playing the blame game.

When you think of it it's kind of comical. There's a show about the greatest dynasty in the history of football that wants to poke holes in it and act like something bad happened. That makes me feel the same as Tedy when he said they became villains and he liked it.

 

[Steve102]

That makes me feel the same as Tedy when he said they became villains and he liked it.

I liked it. He's right... Eff everyone else.

 

[venecol]

I learned that I wouldn't want to have had a private conversation with Bob Kraft only to see it told to the world.

You know I'm not Bill's biggest fan but Kraft is coming across as ungrateful for what Bill accomplished here and he seems to be playing the blame game.

When you think of it it's kind of comical. There's a show about the greatest dynasty in the history of football that wants to poke holes in it and act like something bad happened. That makes me feel the same as Tedy when he said they became villains and he liked it.

I don't know. Nothing that's come out so far takes anything away from being a fan of the greatest dynasty in NFL history.

Knowing more details about what was actually happening behind the curtains, brings more admiration for them being able to sustain it for as long as they did.

I can't wait to learn more interesting information about the dynamics between Bill, Brady and Kraft. The dynasty died in 2019. Some people just didn't realize it.

 

[Jim Beankie]

What is inaccurate about that? It was reported back in 2007 that Kraft called Bill a schmuck when he asked him if there was material benefit to the taping and Bill said no.

I remember being very unhappy with Kraft that he said that in public (even though he was right since all that ****storm for something that was not even that useful) because you don't say that publicly especially back then when it was us against the world.

That was the first time and beginning of Kraft's imagine losing its shine in my mind. That said, it is very easy to understand there would be instances he would not see eye to eye with Bill after 20 years. Just because some blind homers think Bill was perfect does not mean everyone shared the same opinion.

He also gave Bill all the credit for sticking with Brady over Bledsoe. So not really sure what people's problem is with Kraft in this documentary except it shatters some of their fairy tale they have been in denial about since 2017 or so.

FYI, I think the schmuck line didn't come out until 5 years after spygate in Myers' book Coaching Confidential.

 

[SVN]

Kelley: “The Dynasty” Confirms Bill Belichick Was a Goner

Apple TV’s “The Dynasty” docuseries has released the first four episodes. It has shown a lot of important moments from the Patriots past. It covered Robert Kraft purchasing the team, the first three Super Bowl wins, the Super Bowl loss in 2007, and the Spygate saga. But the series also foretold...

patriotsfootballnow.com

Belichick is put in an extremely difficult situation during the filming of the docuseries. Unlike others who can speak freely about their feelings and memories, Belichick was still employed by the New England Patriots while this was being filmed.


I asked “The Dynasty” director Matthew Hamachek about this imbalance to Belichick’s disadvantage. Hamachek had said about 70 people were interviewed for the series. I asked how many interviewees were employed by the New England Patriots while the interviews were being conducted.

“Less than five,” Hamachek responded.

The only non-Kraft employees shown so far have been Bill Belichick and Robyn Glaser. I wonder if Belichick would still stoically bite his tongue recounting certain aspects of his tenure if the interviews were conducted after he had “parted ways” with the franchise.


It has been noted by some in the Boston media that Belichick was reportedly not as generous with his time as others. I have to ask, why would he have been? He was not able to speak freely at the time, and the focus seemed to be on how horrible he was. In seven years (2001-to-2007) the New England Patriots won three Super Bowls and had the first 16-0 season in NFL history. Somehow 25% of coverage for that timespan is devoted to Spygate. Sprinkle in the owner calling the head coach a shmuck while claiming to want to protect said coach’s reputation.

Parting Ways​

Bill Belichick and the New England Patriots “parted ways” following the 2023 season. This docuseries makes it quite apparent Robert Kraft was planning to do so before the season even started. No chance the Patriots owner makes these comments about a man he planned to continue working with.


Kraft met the media alongside Belichick at a press conference following the firing of the winningest coach of the Super Bowl Era. All the right things were said.

“The man standing to my left brought the leadership and coaching skills that were needed to make the type of unprecedented success that we have had possible,” lauded Kraft. “Coach Belichick will forever be celebrated as a legendary sports icon in New England.”

It is tough for New England to celebrate a disloyal, unfair, schmuck though. Those are all descriptions of Bill Belichick from “The Dynasty” to date. And from what I’ve been told, the worst is yet to come. Hard to fathom these episodes being aired with Bill Belichick still employed by the Patriots. It is one thing to know one’s former employer badmouths them. It is quite another to have to walk into the office and face that co-worker daily.

Seems Robert Kraft knew while he spoke that would not be an issue for him and Bill Belichick. The New England Patriots owner cannot bear the burden of everything that is said or shown in “The Dynasty.” He is, however, responsible for what he says. What Kraft says makes it hard to imagine Bill Belichick coaching New England in 2024 was ever truly on the table.

 

[1960Pats]

I don't know. Nothing that's come out so far takes anything away from being a fan of the greatest dynasty in NFL history.

Knowing more details about what was actually happening behind the curtains, brings more admiration for them being able to sustain it for as long as they did.

I can't wait to learn more interesting information about the dynamics between Bill, Brady and Kraft. The dynasty died in 2019. Some people just didn't realize it.

I would prefer to hear more from the Pats players and less from the media. I would trust that more.

If it's a documentary about the dynasty they should examine how it was born as well as how it died. They seem to only want to provide the negative and take down Belichick. Maybe they feel it's payback time for Bill.

Talk is that this was done in 2022 and 2023. If that's true then it looks like Kraft already knew that he was moving on from Bill.

And from what I've heard this "documentary" is only going to get worse.

 

[1960Pats]

Kelley: “The Dynasty” Confirms Bill Belichick Was a Goner

Apple TV’s “The Dynasty” docuseries has released the first four episodes. It has shown a lot of important moments from the Patriots past. It covered Robert Kraft purchasing the team, the first three Super Bowl wins, the Super Bowl loss in 2007, and the Spygate saga. But the series also foretold...

patriotsfootballnow.com

Yup, this whole mess has blown up in Kraft's face and clearly shows that he was already moving on from Bill when it was made. The funny thing is that The Dynasty has done the exact opposite of what the Krafts intended. They drop another notch every time they take a shot at Bill.

 

[Steve102]

Yup, this whole mess has blown up in Kraft's face and clearly shows that he was already moving on from Bill when it was made. The funny thing is that The Dynasty has done the exact opposite of what the Krafts intended. They drop another notch every time they take a shot at Bill.

I think there's something to interviewing a subject and where they are emotionally at that moment. Look at NFL 100, and Bill and Tom were in that moment, and it showed. When Bill was interviewed for the Do You Jobs, they were filmed fairly close to the Super Bowls, and they were all clearly basking in it still. Then there's the layer of trust that Bill has for NFL Films, and you end up with him being very open, because he knows if he says something he regrets, they'll take it out. With this project, he clearly is guarded, he knows the team is not good, and my guess is he's withdrawing even more, trusting fewer and fewer people. The product on the field certainly shows that.

Kraft, same way. At the very least, with Bill's age, he knows the end is very near, even if he's fielding a great team. Bill's not fielding a great team, so Kraft is no doubt looking at it very skeptically. There's gotta be a big tinge of regret too. He didn't meddle in the team, and he has gotta be wishing he kept Tom instead. Not that they would have won more, but maybe he could have done something different as far back as 2018. Who knows?