Story on Patriots' documentary brings recent dysfunction to light

[SVN]

Unless BB can learn from it, take 8-10 months to reflect on the past 2+ decades, what went well, what didn’t, etc, come into interviews with a better perspective having had time away from things, and articulate to owner(s) how he will evolve/adapt in how he treats and interacts with players.

The thing is, though, I don’t think BB was an ******* all the time, or even in general. I think he was uncompromising and unbending when it came to how he coached the team and enforced discipline.

The sticking point for TB12 wasn’t that BB was too mean; it’s that he didn’t acknowledge TB12 as a peer. I think TB12 had earned that right and likely felt he should be treated less like every other guy, and more as a peer to BB, with greater respect given to him, with an acknowledgment/appreciation of/for his career, football acumen, accumulated on-field experience, and the contributions he made to the team’s success during their time together in New England.

That’s why I think that folks are getting ahead of their skis, here. A handful of quotes are telling us BB was extremely hard to play for (shocking, right?), and us, being prisoners of the moment, are allowing this to color the entire narrative.

Is BB a **** at times (press conferences, coaching points, on/off-field discipline)? Absolutely.
Does he feel strongly about his style of / approach to coaching? No doubt.
Is he a raging, antisocial ******* worthy of derision? No.

The issue is any owner who wants to hire him again is going to talk robert and jonathan kraft. Dont think they wull give a ringing endorsement for him .

 

[Steve102]

The issue is any owner who wants to hire him again is going to talk robert and jonathan kraft. Dont think they wull give a ringing endorsement for him .

IMO, he's coached his last game as a HC. No one is going to give him the keys to the kingdom to become the Patriots 2.0, to only do it again in 2-4 years.

 

[SVN]

 

[Steve102]

Him and Borges can pound sand.

 

[archstanton543]

If that's the case then why did Tom and BB agree to take part in the documentary?

 

[HSanders]

If that's the case then why did Tom and BB agree to take part in the documentary?

guessing:tb because he wanted his exact side out there
bb: because his boss required it.

 

[lancerman]

guessing:tb because he wanted his exact side out there
bb: because his boss required it.

Bill is literally there to put out his side

 

[203Pat]

Bill is literally there to put out his side

Yeah I don't see the "hit piece" on Bill that the ever sensitive Team Bill does. I think the doc tried to make the parallel between the backlash from the fans over benching Kosar and how that easily could have happened to Bill again if benching Drew didn't work out. Not sure why the delicate members of Team Bill want the doc to go in depth on a decision made in Cleveland in a documentary about New England. So far my only gripes are the Drew slander 20 years later and it making that Rams game out to be some big debacle that they had to rally from. We have heard numerous times over the years how being completive in that game gave the team a huge confidence boost in that they could compete with the NFL's best.

 

[HSanders]

Bill is literally there to put out his side

i thought the commentary here has been he didn't say much?

Yeah I don't see the "hit piece" on Bill that the ever sensitive Team Bill does.

i didn't make that comment because i'm sensitive etc. i made it because bb in general has never been big on deconstructing stuff in the moment(while still currently working there) that is of this nature.

 

[203Pat]

i thought the commentary here has been he didn't say much?

i didn't make that comment because i'm sensitive etc. i made it because bb in general has never been big on deconstructing stuff in the moment(while still currently working there) that is of this nature.

I get that this will likely be a Kraft puff piece as part of his HOF push but so far I don't see it in the first two episodes. I won't argue that at the Mayo introductory press conference there seemed to be a lot of passive aggressive comments likely aimed at Bill so I am not saying Kraft is above all that but I just didn't see it so far in this doc.

 

[upstater1]

It is well documented the scouting dep was high on both and BB passed. We where discussing ipotheticals. Imagine TB throwing to this 2 guys (it was 2019 draft, of course)

And if we are in 2017 it does not matter what actually happened in 2018 since, you know, it has not happened yet....

In any case fom me would have worked to fire BB after 2018 (instead of 217) and trade Gilmore for a 1st. That is what old school BB would have done. That was the window to move on, that 2 years.

That happened in 2019.

The decision to move from the Patriots happened BEFORE that draft. In fact, Brady appeared on Ross's boat before Deebo ever stepped on an NFL field for a game.

What happened in 2017 is obviously entirely relevant to the situation since THAT'S when the Kraft-Brady meeting and the discussions with Lynch happened.

But whatever, I see in this latest post that the reality of the defensive masterpiece of the Feb '19 Super Bowl is now dropped from the discussion.

 

[neuronet]

It's 100% a Robert Kraft production. Bill was not excited for this project. He was not clamoring to be interviewed. Kraft, OTOH, was all in.

 

[Triumph]

Kraft's little finger prints are all over the end of the Dynasty.

When Brady went crying to Kraft about Jimmy, Kraft got Jimmy 86ed.

 

[Guts]

Kraft's little finger prints are all over the end of the Dynasty.

When Brady went crying to Kraft about Jimmy, Kraft got Jimmy 86ed.

Which was the right choice
Jimmy Sucks ass

 

[203Pat]

Kraft's little finger prints are all over the end of the Dynasty.

When Brady went crying to Kraft about Jimmy, Kraft got Jimmy 86ed.

So your hero should've kept Jimmy over Brady in 2017?

 

[0818NePa]

That happened in 2019.

The decision to move from the Patriots happened BEFORE that draft. In fact, Brady appeared on Ross's boat before Deebo ever stepped on an NFL field for a game.

What happened in 2017 is obviously entirely relevant to the situation since THAT'S when the Kraft-Brady meeting and the discussions with Lynch happened.

But whatever, I see in this latest post that the reality of the defensive masterpiece of the Feb '19 Super Bowl is now dropped from the discussion.

Im perfectly aware of the chronology. It is looking at (and because of) it that I made the arguments I made.

If ring n. 6 was or not (of course it was !!!) a D masterpiece has nothing to do with what I was discussing and this rhread is about (org dysfunction and log term history and prospective outlook of the franchise).

Well in any case nice conversation.

 

[venecol]

Sorry my man, I don't think it's obvious, which is why I started the What If thread. It's easy to cherry pick, as I did, with the Butler situation and the Welker situation and say there's those opportunities that he screwed it up. But do they even get to the first three if he's not who he is and coaches how he coaches? Who knows, right?

To your point, yeah, he could have played it differently, as Parcells suggests., except he simply can't do it. I don't think it's in his DNA to be able to alter his approach. He's like a robot. Like a terminator. He can't be bargained with. He can't be reasoned with. He doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear! And he absolutely will not stop, ever.

I agree with you. It's unfortunate that his arrogance makes him unable to adapt his approach to managing the players. That's why I find it highly unlikely any team will hire him in the future. But who knows.

 

[Steve102]

I agree with you. It's unfortunate that his arrogance makes him unable to adapt his approach to managing the players. That's why I find it highly unlikely any team will hire him in the future. But who knows.

I don't think it's arrogance, at least not in his methods. I think he does what he does because this is how he does it, robotically. Arrogance would make him think that he's right, and for the better part of his career, he was right. Until he wasn't.

 

[ahmed]

Do other fanbases do this? "Hey let's celebrate an unprecedented amount of success by burning it all down!"

That's what happens when you run out the greatest player in NFL history let alone your team's history. A lot of resentment that Bill will never live down.

 

[ahmed]

Bob and Bill burnt it all done. It should have never ended the way it did with Brady. Look at how Kobe's career ended, Ortiz, Jeter. I mean what they did was bat **** crazy to the GOAT.

I dont understand why people don't understand this.