Report: Mac was reaching out to other coaches about his frustrations with the offense

[Ian]

I don’t want Mac to fail…I just don’t want to be tricked into thinking he’s likely to succeed long-term. Wishful thinking and cherry picking is what most fans do when hoping their precious first rounder isn’t what everyone outside the org realizes he is. His upside is Ryan Tannehill, an obvious starting QB significantly better than the backup and can game manage to wins (with a lot of help) against crap teams but is still a huge liability against great ones.

I wouldn't go quite to that extent. As I mentioned, Mac doesn't come up with too many WTF moments, which is one of his strengths. He just doesn't have the physical tools a lot of the elite guys have. He's a cerebral player, and he's a guy who needs playmakers around him. Can't win you a game on his own the way the last guy did. Not that we walked away from this year knowing a whole lot than we knew before the season started.

 

[Ian]

He's surrounded by less playmaking ability than most other top young QBs. It's no wonder he's two players in one, he has to be, and Baltimore has been very fortunate that he's uber-talented.

You and @MAC10 have a gift. Your both masters of moving the goalposts faster than any other user on here. The older I get, the harder it is to keep up with you guys. It's impressive.

 

[State]

What is going on in this forum: first @Ross12 is a Mac-hater, now Ian a Zappe-hater. Very negative and toxic place. Lol

Obviously, play Hoyer who was doing fine in Lambeau Field until Wynn picked daisies rather than block the DE. I jest.

 

[JR52]

As I mentioned, Mac doesn't come up with too many WTF moments, which is one of his strengths.

I'm convinced we aren't watching the same games.

 

[PatsWSB47]

The argument had to do with arm strength, not the release time. So it's based on the time and distance from the release to the time it reaches the receiver. Two throws, Mac's is 20yds, Zappe's is 21 (both air yards). Mac threw his flat-footed, Zappe had to crow-hop and gun it. It was basically for all the people that said Mac had a weaker arm. It just isn't the case, at least right now.

Again, as I said in another post, that could change over the offseason as Mac has a year on Zappe in terms of strength/conditioning, etc.

Ian, did you take in account the Zappe's throw was going more across the field than Mac's? I think that adds a few yards to Zappe's throw. I do think Mac's got a little better arm nevertheless.

 

[Deus Irae]

Great. Wasn't talking about that. I said most of the top young QBs right now have at least one playmaker on offense. Lamar is a bad comp, completely different player. He's like two players in one, doesn't fit this particular discussion. He's a unicorn.

He's also got Andrews, who's a perfect fit for that QB/Offense combo

 

[zipster9]

Like I said. Mac needs a QB consultant to help him out.
Josh Allen did that and the rest is history!!

 

[foxboroughfraser]

All QBs get balls batted: Brady, Mahomes, Rodgers, Lawrence, Allen, Burrow, Herbert, Jackson.

This is the silliest talking point out there.

Lmao I doubt Mac Jones can take that team anywhere. Especially with Bowles and Leftwich as coaches. Huge downgrade at qb there, cheaper though.

 

[Deus Irae]

All QBs get balls batted: Brady, Mahomes, Rodgers, Lawrence, Allen, Burrow, Herbert, Jackson.

This is the silliest talking point out there.

It's not a silly point at all, though. It happens to some more than others, and the possibility also impacts how certain QBs have to play.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Like I said. Mac needs a QB consultant to help him out.
Josh Allen did that and the rest is history!!

Josh Allen was regarded by many as the most physically talented QB prospect since Elway and maybe even more talented. He came from a small school and universal consensus was he needed time to develop.

All I’ve heard about for years is how BB is the best QB coach in the league, the Patriots have the best org for developing QBs, the best system, coaching, development, film study, support system etc. Something has to give here. The “greatest QB developing mastermind ever” now needs to hire a big buddy for Mac because, why? He’s busy with more important things? Pretty sure Mac has all the QB/football expertise he’s going to get.

 

[crawhammer]

Josh Allen was regarded by many as the most physically talented QB prospect since Elway and maybe even more talented. He came from a small school and universal consensus was he needed time to develop.

All I’ve heard about for years is how BB is the best QB coach in the league, the Patriots have the best org for developing QBs, the best system, coaching, development, film study, support system etc. Something has to give here. The “greatest QB developing mastermind ever” now needs to hire a big buddy for Mac because, why? He’s busy with more important things? Pretty sure Mac has all the QB/football expertise he’s going to get.

Since when are the Patriots churning out great quarterbacks? Talk about Brady induced hyperbole. The "system." You mean the one Cam bottomed out with? That they trashed three seasons after Brady left? Because it was too complicated for the Bill's unqualified buddy who couldn't handle even a generic offense.

 

[TFB=GOAT]

For maybe all but 3 or 4 unicorn quarterbacks in the league I think offensive system and legitimate weapons/playmakers is the key to success.

Now clearly Mac isn’t one of the unicorns so he needs an adequate offensive system and playmakers to succeed.

My issue with the “Mac isn’t the guy” takes is the patriots don’t currently have a functional NFL system or above average weapons to succeed. And I believe with most of the quarterbacks in this league (even some good veteran qbs) we would have seen very similar results this year.

If they get a legitimate offensive coordinator next year and some receivers who strike even an ounce of fear in a defense, and Mac struggles again then I’ll admit it’s time to move on.

 

[venecol]

If the Patriots move on from Mac and pick up a good vet like JG or somehow get near the top of the draft and pick one of the big 3 Levis/Young/Stroud it will be interesting to see who still thinks the Patriots are keeping a star on the bench by not starting Zappe. My guess is almost nobody.

Zappe >>> JG, but dreamy Jimmy is better looking.

 

[h0c2000]

I think the Mac vs Zappe arm debating is basically splitting hairs. I don’t think either one has a good arm and that is a big reason why Mac struggled. He doesn't have the physical tools to overcome this dysfunctional of an offense. He makes up for a lack of arm strength with timing and anticipation and there certainly wasn't much of that this season.

Mike Vick had a cannon for an arm. How did that work out?

 

[Ross12]

If the Patriots move on from Mac and pick up a good vet like JG or somehow get near the top of the draft and pick one of the big 3 Levis/Young/Stroud it will be interesting to see who still thinks the Patriots are keeping a star on the bench by not starting Zappe. My guess is almost nobody.

If Bill feels like it's not going to work with Mac, he has a prime opportunity to trade him for a 2nd (probably) and use that pick plus your large stock of other picks this year to move up from #14 into the top 10 and grab another QB you like. If he's starter quality as a rookie, start him. If you want to sit him, you could play Zappe or sign Jimmy for a couple of seasons.

Bill's not going to get another chance with a pick this high and a crop of QBs that are this good that he can slide up for. If he has another year where they finish around #14 his butt might not be here the next year to make the pick. Kraft wants results. If he grabs a new QB and starts a veteran it does buy him a little more time, and he can sell the pitch that he's setting up Mayo or whomever for long term greatness.

Again, this is all IF Bill has hesitancy about Mac and likes one of the top QBs this year. If he feels Mac can turn it around and be their QBOTF for 2023 and beyond he should keep him.

 

[TFB=GOAT]

Zappe >>> JG, but dreamy Jimmy is better looking.

Jimmy clears Zappe in everything

 

[venecol]

Stidham always had a very strong arm. Everything else about his game needed a lot of work.

He's also photogenic. Look at how he keeps the watch in the center of the frame. That's very hard to do in an action shot. Perfect form.

 

[alvinnf]

If Bill feels like it's not going to work with Mac, he has a prime opportunity to trade him for a 2nd (probably) and use that pick plus your large stock of other picks this year to move up from #14 into the top 10 and grab another QB you like. If he's starter quality as a rookie, start him. If you want to sit him, you could play Zappe or sign Jimmy for a couple of seasons.

Bill's not going to get another chance with a pick this high and a crop of QBs that are this good that he can slide up for. If he has another year where they finish around #14 his butt might not be here the next year to make the pick. Kraft wants results. If he grabs a new QB and starts a veteran it does buy him a little more time, and he can sell the pitch that he's setting up Mayo or whomever for long term greatness.

Again, this is all IF Bill has hesitancy about Mac and likes one of the top QBs this year. If he feels Mac can turn it around and be their QBOTF for 2023 and beyond he should keep him.

2 things.

This QB class in my opinion is not that strong, your opinion might differ. Every year QB’s get pumped up in a draft class. There is always a bell for the ball so to speak.

A 2nd for Mac Jones? Maybe from the Raiders? I think it is a more realistic approach to try and get Mac’s value back up. Then set him free. Now that is a risky proposition. It seems that ownership is more engaged in the process. That’s the only thing that leads me to believe Mac might stay. Even if it is for the short term. Pretty sure Bill knows he is not the guy. But Bill mishandled the situation so poorly. I think he ended up fencing himself in.

 

[captain stone]

Not on the field because he stunk for us but I found him likeable off the field.

He was a clown, both on & off the field, and before he ever came into the league.

 

[captain stone]

This keeps coming up but there is no indication that he called Josh. They never mention Josh. It seems likely that Josh would be someone he reached out to given his former relationship, but its not a given. He could've called any of his 3 former college OCs for all we know, incl. BoB.

My first guess is Steve Sarkisian; he was Mac's OC/QBC for his last two years at Alabama. Daboll & then Dan Enos had him for a year each.

Second is Obie; Mac helped him learn the offense when he became OC at 'Bama two years ago next week.

If Mac did indeed contact McD, then I hope that didn't happen until after their game. As long as it did, then I'm cool with that too.