I truly have no idea what you are really saying. Why are Mahomes, Allen and Herbert scheme specific? Are you truly saying that Herbert is an example of a new breed of QB? I can see that Mahomes and Allen have legs but they both have very strong traditional "pocket" QB skills as well and those will continue to improve and dominate their play as their legs skills fade.
And what part of what you are saying is research and not opinion? The NCAA has always had QB's that relied on legs as well as arms and always will because the legs are always fresh there.
What's really changed? Lamar Jackson? He isn't a trend by himself. The two QB's stylistically most like him last year (Trey Lance and Justin Fields) have so far not produced. Zach Wilson's off platform improvisations have been near disastrous for him. Vince Young failed. Cam Newton and Michael Vick flamed out. Russell Wilson might be fading too.
I get that lots of folks are saying what you're saying, especially emphasizing the importance of "off platform" plays, but that's opinion too, clearly mostly in response to Mahomes's incredible success. Other than echoing those opinions, what actual research supports your claim that pocket QB's are dead?
If you are saying that if Tom Brady was starting his career today he would fail because the game has changed so much, that's crazy. If you are saying he and Peyton Manning wouldn't get a chance today in the NCAA and hence in the NFL because their skills are out of fashion that's very sad if true and hardly anything to crow about. And observing NFL history, all it takes to blow up a foolish fashion trend is contrarian success.
And at the NCAA level, historic recent measurable success by the likes Joe Burrow, Mac Jones and Bailey Zappe is sure to be noticed and nurtured by someone. Even if it's only at the Western Kentucky's.
And none of what I'm saying should be taken to mean that I believe Mac Jones or Bailey Zappe in particular will succeed in the NFL, let alone become superstars. Or that Justin Fields (whom I actually like a lot) and Trey Lance will fail. But if you're betting that no great pocket QB's will ever again emerge and dominate the future NFL, I'll take the other side of that bet and give you odds. It's still freaking football they're playing.
BTW are you predicting that Arch Manning is overhyped and is DOA at Texas?
Basically this
@Kasmir as me and
@1960Pats have been through this once or fifteen times
I think it went something like this:
NCAA HCs were training QB's for years to be pocket passers for the NYFL.
NCAA HCs lost their jobs when that didn't win at the college level.
NCAA HCs started using running QBs more and more.
The NYFL has less pocket passers to choose from and is forced to take in more running QBs.
Nice job man.
So yea coaches saw that "athletes", kids that could run as well as throw were a making an easy transition to the schemes flourishing at the high school and college level so it was a natural mix. It's copycats sport so the market was flooded. So the NFL only has so much say, so many prospects to choose from.
I just see less guys that can stand back there and beat you consistently with their arm/mind and more guys that can throw on the move, run, need PA, running game to complement their strengths etc
It's not that you don't need to pass. You'll always have to be able to pass from the pocket at a high level. It's just the position has changed in other ways.
I should have been clearer on something above also.
Guys like Mahomes, Herbert, Allen, Tom Brady, AR etc are the system. They'll excel and succeed in almost any system once they've figured it out from an individual pov. Like at their peaks you can drop them in any system and they'd succeed. Then you have Joe Brady, Dak, Jackson who have shown greatness but inconsistencies and quite frankly their teams could pick up the slack in some areas. Dallas has done a nice job of building a balanced team.
Then you have guys like Jimmy, Mayfield, Goff, Lawrence, Wilson, Lance, Tua, Trubisky etc who all need a proper scheme fit, running game, PA. They need a lot to make it work and are system guys. Whereas the guys above are the system. Give or take, on different tiers.
QB's who happen to be strict pocket passers will always succeed if they're good. They'll always have a place and you absolutely have to pass to win. The position has just morphed in other areas. In part mostly to the lower levels.
