Dr. Gill Steps Down

[shmessy]

........ Gill was the one that saved the Patriots from getting ripped off by Jonathan Fanene.

Doctors in this sport are in a no-win situation. You're damned if you tell a player he can't play and he complains that he's ready (Spikes) and you're damned if you say he can play and then he proceeds to aggravate the injury (Gronk).

I'm guessing you are using sarcasm there.

It Is What It Is » Patriots, Jonathan Fanene reportedly reach formal settlement

In the meantime, didn't the Patriots have two (2) players out last season from post-op "infections"? Yup. Gronk and Armstead.

 

[Danger Zone]

Statement from the New England Patriots

Dr. Matt Provencher is the new chief of sports medicine at MGH and will become the team's new medical director.​

To a layman like me he has a very impressive resume:

Dr. Matthew Provencher, Chief, Sports Medicine Service - Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston, MA

The 28 Top U.S. Shoulder Surgeons | Orthopedics This Week

Matthew Provencher | LinkedIn

Dr. Matthew Provencher, MD - Orthopaedic Surgeon in Cambridge, MA - Orthopaedic Surgery | Vitals.com

Dr. Matthew T. Provencher, MD - Boston, MA - Sports Medicine & Orthopedic Surgery | Healthgrades.com

They've already hired a new team Doctor? Well, so much for my write-in candidate...

 

[Boston Boxer]

You know, who are we to judge the job performance of a medical Doctor?

Though there certainly was the perception of a needed change at the position.

And now that Ive been responsibly objective, hold on a minute while I grab my torch and pitchfork -we got some celebrating to do!!

WE JUDGE EVERYTHING...get on board or get run over lol

 

[ausbacker]

I believe he was typing quickly like so many of us. I remember reading that Lloyd and Price may have had ADD or been bi-polar. Probably mis-remembering the specific handicaps. Regardless, such problems do need to be detected where possible by the medical staff.

I think that the Faenane (sp?) debacle forced BB to take a fresh, hard look at the medical dept.

According to the Seahawks medical staff, three quarters of their team has ADHD which can be effectively treated with Adderall.

 

[Brady6]

I can see why the players are happy. Gill was the one that saved the Patriots from getting ripped off by Jonathan Fanene.

Not really, he did not stop them from signing him.

 

[Deus Irae]

I can see why the players are happy. Gill was the one that saved the Patriots from getting ripped off by Jonathan Fanene.

Doctors in this sport are in a no-win situation. You're damned if you tell a player he can't play and he complains that he's ready (Spikes) and you're damned if you say he can play and then he proceeds to aggravate the injury (Gronk).

That's a little like saying, "he may have had cholera or the flu." A little bit of difference in terms of presenting symptoms, seriousness, and implications as a teammate and player.

This entire thread is the "case closed" evidence on how it is simultaneously impossible and irresistible to make evaluations about the organization from the outside in, with almost no real data, just symptoms.

Hmmm...

Tight end Rob Gronkowski clashed with Gill last year over his fractured forearm; Gronkowski broke his forearm twice in two months, then developed an infection after surgery that forced him to have two subsequent operations. Gronkowski had his fourth and final forearm surgery performed by Dr. James Andrews, and again used Andrews this offseason to repair his torn MCL and ACL.

With the Red Sox, Gill came under fire when Jacoby Ellsbury’s fractured ribs went undiagnosed for several months in 2010. But Gill remained with the team before stepping down after the 2011 season.

Dr. Thomas Gill leaves post as Patriots' doctor - Sports - The Boston Globe

Patriots announced departure of Dr. Tom Gill who is leaving MGH to focus on private practice. Some swore by Gill. Others swore about him.

Twitter / tomecurran: Patriots announce departure...

A number of Red Sox players, including Ellsbury and former infielder Jed Lowrie, also expressed dissatisfaction to team management over Gill's care, according to sources.

Friction in Boston medical staff divided team -- sources - ESPN Boston

At one point, Epstein fired Gill and tried to transfer his duties to team internist Dr. Larry Ronan and Reinold, but was immediately overruled by Henry.

Friction in Boston medical staff divided team -- sources - ESPN Boston

Yup.... It's just us posters railing against the guy for no reason at all.

 

[BTTA]

This would happen (and will happen) in Boston regardless of who the physician is. Every medical problem will be seen as the physician's fault, everything will be second guessed. It's the nature of the pro sports culture in southern NE.

There's just no way to look from the outside in, in retrospect, and make an accurate judgment on a medical situation. Actual facts are required, not just after-effects.

Hmmm...

Yup.... It's just us posters railing against the guy for no reason at all.

 

[varjao]

The whole story involving Gronk's forearm fracture is absolutely unbelievable. I have read two sides from this story, some who defend the natural healing, some who understood why they chose an invasive procedure.

Well I'm not a physician but I have been through some procedures, I read a lot, someone will have a hard time to explain me why they chose this procedure to cure a simple fracture that could have healed 100% in 2 months using a fu..ing cast. Instead, using a invasive procedure that always brings some risk, with all the consequences that happened, jeopardizing a promising career, just for rushing him to be available for the playoffs, it just doesn't fit BB's rationale.

That's a huge case, If, god forbids, Gronk gets another problem in that arm due to some weakness, after all nobody really knows the status of that arm, Gil should be sued for bad practice of medicine.

 

[makoute]

You know, who are we to judge the job performance of a medical Doctor?

Though there certainly was the perception of a needed change at the position.

And now that Ive been responsibly objective, hold on a minute while I grab my torch and pitchfork -we got some celebrating to do!!

You don't celebrate with torch and pitchfork, you celebrate after torching and pitchforking sir!

 

[shmessy]

This would happen (and will happen) in Boston regardless of who the physician is. Every medical problem will be seen as the physician's fault, everything will be second guessed. It's the nature of the pro sports culture in southern NE.

There's just no way to look from the outside in, in retrospect, and make an accurate judgment on a medical situation. Actual facts are required, not just after-effects.

Ellsbury, Lowerie, Fanene, Gronkowski, Theo Epstein, Armstead, Belichick were ALL on the inside.

And don't think for a moment the very public comments by Spikes and Talib about the false reporting of their injuries isn't a possible part of this also.

You are just closing your eyes.

 

[bresna]

The whole story involving Gronk's forearm fracture is absolutely unbelievable. I have read two sides from this story, some who defend the natural healing, some who understood why they chose an invasive procedure.

Well I'm not a physician but I have been through some procedures, I read a lot, someone will have a hard time to explain me why they chose this procedure to cure a simple fracture that could have healed 100% in 2 months using a fu..ing cast. Instead, using a invasive procedure that always brings some risk, with all the consequences that happened, jeopardizing a promising career, just for rushing him to be available for the playoffs, it just doesn't fit BB's rationale.

That's a huge case, If, god forbids, Gronk gets another problem in that arm due to some weakness, after all nobody really knows the status of that arm, Gil should be sued for bad practice of medicine.

There is a story floating around that Gronk was completely on board with the surgery. Patients do have a say in their medical decisions. Knowing Gronk, he wanted to play and the surgery gave him the chance to do just that. He also knew the risks associated with that decision.

FWIW, I've read that Gronk's forearm will likely be stronger than it was before after it fully heals.

 

[Deus Irae]

This would happen (and will happen) in Boston regardless of who the physician is. Every medical problem will be seen as the physician's fault, everything will be second guessed. It's the nature of the pro sports culture in southern NE.

There's just no way to look from the outside in, in retrospect, and make an accurate judgment on a medical situation. Actual facts are required, not just after-effects.

You were pretty much completely wrong in your initial post. Learn when to stop digging the hole.

 

[varjao]

FWIW, I've read that Gronk's forearm will likely be stronger than it was before after it fully heals.

That's the case for basically any fracture and it would certainly be the case if they had treated him with the most basic procedure to cure a broken arm. Now, after 4 surgeries and infection I have no clue what's going on with that arm, it's not my area, but all the mess around this story just doesn't sound good. I hope it's 100% ok by now, after all this time to recover including some action last season.

 

[Danger Zone]

You were pretty much completely wrong in your initial post. Learn when to stop digging the hole.

Deus has made his mind on this matter known. He suggests you stop posting now.

 

[FalconHeavy]

Ellsbury, Lowerie, Fanene, Gronkowski, Theo Epstein, Armstead, Belichick were ALL on the inside.

And don't think for a moment the very public comments by Spikes and Talib about the false reporting of their injuries isn't a possible part of this also.

You are just closing your eyes.

my AHA moment right there... may be this rabbit hole goes deeper than we thought

 

[Danger Zone]

my AHA moment right there... may be this rabbit hole goes deeper than we thought

Im actually elated that we've made a change here. I say this in the case I did a poor job communicating this earlier.

But Spikes was very obviously hampered and slowed by a very real injury. He just wants to claim he could have played through the injury he did have. I wonder what he'd be Tweeting now if he'd have been allowed to play and injured himself even further?

Talib is complaining about the nuances of the label of 'hip injury' vs 'quad injury' which to my understanding is simply a more exacting and specific description of the type of injury that could in truth be labelled a hip injury in broader terms.

I think it's clear he wanted to counter the impression he has the same nagging injury just as Im sure that it's in the Players best interest to have their injuries described in as generic a way as possible.

Head hunting is a very real thing. Ive watched the Saints play and Ive seen the Longest Yard..

 

[Avenger]

The whole story involving Gronk's forearm fracture is absolutely unbelievable. I have read two sides from this story, some who defend the natural healing, some who understood why they chose an invasive procedure.

Well I'm not a physician but I have been through some procedures, I read a lot, someone will have a hard time to explain me why they chose this procedure to cure a simple fracture that could have healed 100% in 2 months using a fu..ing cast. Instead, using a invasive procedure that always brings some risk, with all the consequences that happened, jeopardizing a promising career, just for rushing him to be available for the playoffs, it just doesn't fit BB's rationale.

That's a huge case, If, god forbids, Gronk gets another problem in that arm due to some weakness, after all nobody really knows the status of that arm, Gil should be sued for bad practice of medicine.

I've talked to some pretty highly regarded orthopedic surgeons in the sports medicine field through my work, the benefits of operating far outweigh the risk.

 

[BTTA]

I've talked to some pretty highly regarded orthopedic surgeons in the sports medicine field through my work, the benefits of operating far outweigh the risk.

Sorry, actual information, particularly medical information, is not allowed in this thread.

I'd suggest you reconsider this, and instead post something that blames surgeons for post-op infections or accepts player complaints as fully valid.

 

[shmessy]

There is a story floating around that Gronk was completely on board with the surgery. Patients do have a say in their medical decisions. Knowing Gronk, he wanted to play and the surgery gave him the chance to do just that. He also knew the risks associated with that decision.

FWIW, I've read that Gronk's forearm will likely be stronger than it was before after it fully heals.

"There is a story floating around......"

Please. Anyone can write "There is a story floating around......"

How "on board" do you think Gronk was with the post operative infection?

How "on board" do you think Gronk was when he switched over to Dr Andrews?

 

[BTTA]

"There is a story floating around......"

Please. Anyone can write "There is a story floating around......"

How "on board" do you think Gronk was with the post operative infection?

How "on board" do you think Gronk was when he switched over to Dr Andrews?

There should be two threads for these two topics, one on the surgery (which is about the doctor) and one on the infection (which is about the hospital). Smurgling the two only extends the misinformation that the surgeon is likely to have had something to do with the infection.