Interesting Piece on Ras-I Dowling on Bleacher Report

[BlueThunder]

I look at it this way....

The secondary can't get any worse than last year

There has to be an improvement...how much improvement will tell us how far they get in the post season....:rocker:

 

[Ring 6]

Jets Fan!!!!!!

Caught me. I spent 40 years pretending to root for the Patriots waiting until the point they had a bad secondary and went to the SB despite it, just so I could trick everyone by making a comment that the poor secondary was poor.
Wow, did I show you guys.

 

[jczxohn1]

Interested to see if Moore can continue to improve next year with an off-season and training camp under his belt. He was a pleasant surprise last year.

 

[Dragda]

Interested to see if Moore can continue to improve next year with an off-season and training camp under his belt. He was a pleasant surprise last year.

I didn't think his modest conttribution was that big of a surprise. Raider fans were horrified that they did not sign him to the 53 man roster because they knew they'd lose him. They said he had a great camp and pre season. I actually expected a lot more out of him. Granted, his AFCC game was worth all the growing pains.

 

[Ring 6]

I didn't think his modest conttribution was that big of a surprise. Raider fans were horrified that they did not sign him to the 53 man roster because they knew they'd lose him. They said he had a great camp and pre season. I actually expected a lot more out of him. Granted, his AFCC game was worth all the growing pains.

We didn't pluck him off the Raiders practice squad, they cut him from the practice squad.
Also, I never get these comments about how heroic it was that he got beat for a TD but got his butt saved because Lee Evans didn't protect the ball from a desperation swat.

 

[supafly]

We didn't pluck him off the Raiders practice squad, they cut him from the practice squad.
Also, I never get these comments about how heroic it was that he got beat for a TD but got his butt saved because Lee Evans didn't protect the ball from a desperation swat.

I hear what you're saying, Andy. I think it was part of the early career growing pains that we tend to see from some players.

Moore did show other good things too though, beside the 'famous' play that you speak of where he actually got beat. That said, he also had some poor plays too.

I think the optimism comes from seeing someone who looked okay during their rookie year (I would even say that he looked better than 'average' at times with his coverage), and the possible versatility that he may bring to the secondary.

 

[Ring 6]

I hear what you're saying, Andy. I think it was part of the early career growing pains that we tend to see from some players.

Moore did show other good things too though, beside the 'famous' play that you speak of where he actually got beat. That said, he also had some poor plays too.

I think the optimism comes from seeing someone who looked okay during their rookie year (I would even say that he looked better than 'average' at times with his coverage), and the possible versatility that he may bring to the secondary.

My experience is that the most overrated players are the guys that no one expected anything of that go out and put up a mediocre level of play.
Fans often make the jump that since they expected them to stink and they were decent, they are now big surprise, 'breakout' players, ready to leap into stardom. When in reality they were usually mediocre players who got a shot and didn't totally step on their dlck.
Edelman is one of these. Guyton was until people started to expect something from him. Russ Hochstein, Tom Ashworth, Dan Klecko, Myron Pryor, Randall Gay, Kyle Love, Sergio Brown (in 2010), Eric Moore and Dane Fletcher are a few others that come to mind, in varying degrees.

 

[Marqui]

My experience is that the most overrated players are the guys that no one expected anything of that go out and put up a mediocre level of play.
Fans often make the jump that since they expected them to stink and they were decent, they are now big surprise, 'breakout' players, ready to leap into stardom. When in reality they were usually mediocre players who got a shot and didn't totally step on their dlck.
Edelman is one of these. Guyton was until people started to expect something from him. Russ Hochstein, Tom Ashworth, Dan Klecko, Myron Pryor, Randall Gay, Kyle Love, Sergio Brown (in 2010), Eric Moore and Dane Fletcher are a few others that come to mind, in varying degrees.

I agree with most of this but imo Moore doesn't fall in that group. I thought he showed some real natural ability last year towards the end of the season and in the postseason.

 

[Mystery Pats Fan]

I look at it this way....

The secondary can't get any worse than last year

It can, immediately, get better by removing Arrington.

 

[Big-T]

It can, immediately, get better by removing Arrington.

You're like a broken record

You do know for most of the season he was 2nd in the league in QB rating allowed? Behind Revis only...

He finished the season in the top 12 overall in completion % allowed and pretty much shut Cruz down in the Super Bowl.

Did Arrington sleep with your wife or something?

 

[Ring 6]

I agree with most of this but imo Moore doesn't fall in that group. I thought he showed some real natural ability last year towards the end of the season and in the postseason.

I think he is the poster boy for this category. I saw him allow an awful lot of completions.
And lets not forget he was cut by BB off of the 32nd ranked pass D in the NFL.

 

[Big-T]

Jeff Reinebold (former SMU receivers coach) said on Sky Sports that Sterling Moore might give up the odd completion but he makes a lot of heads up plays (which has been shown in his brief NFL time) and that he's still raw at the position because he's fairly new to the game so with the correct coaching he could be "a very good NFL player".

He was also surprised to see him in the mix up after Von Miller cheap shotted Connolly saying "he never hit anyone like that at SMU!"

 

[Deus Irae]

Jeff Reinebold (former SMU receivers coach) said on Sky Sports that Sterling Moore might give up the odd completion but he makes a lot of heads up plays (which has been shown in his brief NFL time) and that he's still raw at the position because he's fairly new to the game so with the correct coaching he could be "a very good NFL player".

He was also surprised to see him in the mix up after Von Miller cheap shotted Connolly saying "he never hit anyone like that at SMU!"

The two biggest plays he had all season were:

1.) Hit own teammate resulting in a separated shoulder for McCourty

2.) Got beat by a guy who's been declining for years and is a stiff at this point in his career, but managed to knock the ball away just in time

Some day someone will have to really explain the love for Sterling Moore around here, because the kid sucked at football last season.

 

[Ring 6]

The two biggest plays he had all season were:

1.) Hit own teammate resulting in a separated shoulder for McCourty

2.) Got beat by a guy who's been declining for years and is a stiff at this point in his career, but managed to knock the ball away just in time

Some day someone will have to really explain the love for Sterling Moore around here, because the kid sucked at football last season.

But, but, but, he was the guy who knocked the ball out of Evans hands. Never mind the fact that he was beaten for a game losing TD before the desperation swat.

 

[Big-T]

The two biggest plays he had all season were:

1.) Hit own teammate resulting in a separated shoulder for McCourty

2.) Got beat by a guy who's been declining for years and is a stiff at this point in his career, but managed to knock the ball away just in time

Some day someone will have to really explain the love for Sterling Moore around here, because the kid sucked at football last season.

You forgot that pass defense late in the Super Bowl that Giants fans were adamant was PI, that was a great play.

However, #1 wasn't the best way to start a career, granted.

As for the Evans play, I can't recall anything before him knocking the ball out, was it man or zone coverage?

 

[Marqui]

I think he is the poster boy for this category. I saw him allow an awful lot of completions.
And lets not forget he was cut by BB off of the 32nd ranked pass D in the NFL.

I'd go with Kyle Love as the poster boy for that category. He was atrocious in the superbowl and mediocre at best in the regular season yet some around here talk about him like he's an exceptional player. At least with Moore some people are just saying he has a chance to develop into a solid DB, nobody is saying he's the second coming of Ty Law or something.

 

[Ring 6]

I'd go with Kyle Love as the poster boy for that category. He was atrocious in the superbowl and mediocre at best in the regular season yet some around here talk about him like he's an exceptional player. At least with Moore some people are just saying he has a chance to develop into a solid DB, nobody is saying he's the second coming of Ty Law or something.

Both fit the bill. Both are guys who played more last year than they would if you were happy with your players at their positions.

 

[supafly]

The two biggest plays he had all season were:

1.) Hit own teammate resulting in a separated shoulder for McCourty

2.) Got beat by a guy who's been declining for years and is a stiff at this point in his career, but managed to knock the ball away just in time

Some day someone will have to really explain the love for Sterling Moore around here, because the kid sucked at football last season.

Everyone will always have their own opinion of various players here, so I think that's pretty normal.

I would question your thoughts on his 'biggest plays' of the season, as he had 10 total passes defensed in only 6 games played, 2 INT's, 1 TD, and a big forced fumble in the SB that may have changed the outcome of the game had there not been 12 men on the play.

He also led the team in passes defended in all 3 of the teams playoff games, with 2 in each game.

In comparison, McCourty only had 13 passes defended all yr, and he played in 17 games and was the main target of opposing QB's. If you would project Moore's stats (which is obviously a stretch, but sometimes people do it), he would've had the potential to reach almost 30 passes defended, which would have been way more than 2x as many as any other of our CB's. I am not saying that is a viable stat, b/c we know it wouldn't have turned out that way, but it is something to consider. At the very least 10 passes defended in only 6 games played could be considered impressive by some.

Personally, I think that it seems kind of strange that there are 2 crowds in regards to Sterling Moore--those who like him a lot, and those who think he's garbage. I tend to lean more towards the 'liking him' side due to what I thought were some good ball skills at times.

However, I also think that he made some big mistakes and should not be put on a pedestal either.

We've seen worse from rookie CB's here (and vet CB's too), so maybe it will be something to build on? Maybe you are closer to being right and he will fizzle out quickly, I suppose only time will tell.

 

[supafly]

Both fit the bill. Both are guys who played more last year than they would if you were happy with your players at their positions.

I think your examples of Love and Moore are spot on.

I also think that it could be debated that both may be considered decent depth for measured/balanced rotations and situational reps.

In other words, they can offer depth with the ability to start in a pinch, and they already know the system.

I don't think either one is spectacular on any level or strectch, but they should fit the bill to be two guys who are considered overachivers at times, when you look at their relative cost and draft position (or lack thereof).

 

[Ring 6]

Everyone will always have their own opinion of various players here, so I think that's pretty normal.

I would question your thoughts on his 'biggest plays' of the season, as he had 10 total passes defensed in only 6 games played, 2 INT's, 1 TD, and a big forced fumble in the SB that may have changed the outcome of the game had there not been 12 men on the play.

He also led the team in passes defended in all 3 of the teams playoff games, with 2 in each game.

In comparison, McCourty only had 13 passes defended all yr, and he played in 17 games and was the main target of opposing QB's. If you would project Moore's stats (which is obviously a stretch, but sometimes people do it), he would've had the potential to reach almost 30 passes defended, which would have been way more than 2x as many as any other of our CB's. I am not saying that is a viable stat, b/c we know it wouldn't have turned out that way, but it is something to consider. At the very least 10 passes defended in only 6 games played could be considered impressive by some.

Personally, I think that it seems kind of strange that there are 2 crowds in regards to Sterling Moore--those who like him a lot, and those who think he's garbage. I tend to lean more towards the 'liking him' side due to what I thought were some good ball skills at times.

However, I also think that he made some big mistakes and should not be put on a pedestal either.

We've seen worse from rookie CB's here (and vet CB's too), so maybe it will be something to build on? Maybe you are closer to being right and he will fizzle out quickly, I suppose only time will tell.

I haven't seen anyone call him garbage. I think the most common opinion is that he is what he appears to be, a guy who is, at this point, borderline to make an NFL roster, be on a practice squad or be out of worlk, and if he is on a team whose other choice at nickel is a guy they play a WR in front of, he can get a lot of playing time.
What he BECOMES could go many directions from that. There are reasons to believe he has the basic skill set that could develop into a decent corner, but that puts him in a category with 100s of players, some of which improve and many of which never do much.
Given that he is competing for the 4th corner spot, and has position flexibility to step in at safety at times too, he may have a decent chance to make the team. Lets hope though that he rarely sees the field becuase that will mean McCourty, Dowling, and Arrington are staying healthy and probably playing well. I don't see him ahead of any of those players unless the get injured or spit the bit.