Tom Brady needs to shoulder some blame

[lobster]

Some obvious problems that allowed the Jets to stay in the game:

1. Pennington had virtually no pressure - time after time he could take his time to pass where he was very accurate.
2. The Pat's had problems defending the run up the middle and defending the run on 3rd and short.
3. Offensively too many running plays were dropped for losses.
4. There was a key offensive series where it was like 2rd and 2 in the Jet's red zone so the Pat's called two passes which both went incomplete. They had to take the FG. For some reason the nearer the Pat's get to the goal line the more they want to pass.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

No way. Our receivers were tremendous today. Even Gabriel's fumble was not in a bad spot - it was deep in Jets territory after he made a great play. On the whole the QB threw shallow passes and the receivers made nice plays...they even made some catches that were clearly off the mark.
Even taking the sacks Brady did, he showed no ability to step away or throw the ball away.
I would not let Brady off so easily here. He is a very very distant #2 to Manning and Pennington played a scrappy, cerebral game and outdueled him.
If the roles were reversed, we'd be singing the praises of Brady of how he 'took what the defense gave him' and played smart.
I am not saying to bench anyone...but the guy needs to tighten it up and I do not want to here any more criticism of our solid receiving corps.

You're delusional. Did you watch this game on gamecast or something? BB was so pleased with Gabriel's turning 5 yards and a cloud of dust into a fumble the JETS marched back 81 yards for a TD in the first quarter he never saw the field again. Reche made the headiest play of the season when he snagged that tipped ball, piroetted and took it in for the TD. Week 9 and one of them shows a spark in the 4th quarter, but as a unit they are consistently overmatched unless playing the Vikings. Through week 8 Troy Brown was his best receiver and the one guy he could count on to make a play. A 35 year old 4th WR and occasional PR and backup DB.

That is an indictment on the WR by committee experiment. They are not getting open, even as their QB faces down blitzes, or if they do get open they aren't getting sufficient seperation and he's having to throw it under pressure to where he thinks a defender can't get a hand on it and his WR's seem oblivious to that. When he stands at a microphone and doesn't take the blame for them (Oline and RB and WR) there is a reason.

Belichick doesn't value the WR position. Perhaps teams are catching on to that. He also refuses to adjust blocking to RB's with vastly different skill sets. They seem to have figured that out too. He makes a lot of demands on his players. Unfortunately Brady seems to be the one who pays the price when they don't exceed what he apparently believes are reasonable expectations.

Pennington took a lot of chances today counting on his WR to make plays for him. They did more often than not. That was the real difference between his game today and Brady's. Brady only had one guy step up and it was too little too late.

 

[Drewwho]

Just two weeks ago Brady was the best QB in NFL history. Today he needs to be benched. PLEASE! He has QB'd this team to 3 SB's, 21 game winning streak and up until today did not lose a back to back game in 3 full seasons. I watch a ton of NFL games and it seems to me that every team in the NFL has WR's and TE's that just grab the ball. They go up and get it or make (like today) some great one handed catches. The QB is not always counted on to put the ball in the number. But for most of this season if Brady has not planted it perfect, the balls have either been dropped or tipped. That coupled with bad timed routes are messing up the entire flow of the offense. I think Brady's issues are more mental than physical. He can still throw and lead...that has not changed, but his supporting cast has changed and it is messed him up and he lacks confidence in these guys as much as he gives them credit for playing well and working hard.

Sure, he looked bad today, and last week, but I for one am never going to suggest benching him for anyone let alone Cassel, that is just an amazing statement from any Pat fan.

Brady his human and even the greatest of the greats including Joe Montana and Dan the Man have had back to back loses and bad games. Brady is having a tough year in adjusting to this new offense- WR's and horrible play calling. Not to mention very inconsisent protection.

I saw his press conference and never heard anything unBrady like about it.

I bet the Pats finish 11-5 win the AFCE and win at least one playoff game, but sorry, with our aging defense and 3rd and 4th stringer WR's, we are just not good enough this year...WE - the team, not just Brady!

 

[Willie55]

Actually Tom isn't the 2nd best in the NFL. Cold Hard Football Facts have looked at the active QBs and Tom was #17 this year. When looking at how many TDs for the yards attempted, minus the interceptions. I dont know if that is before the Indy fiasco or after, but it certainly will go down with the Jets data.

You are living in the past when you talk about Brady being great. He was once, and I hope he will be again, but until that time, the team needs to move on and go with the best chance to win. Even if Cassel can't, it may fire up Tom, if he's injured it may let him rest, and in any event he can step back and look at things and get a handle on what is going wrong.

As it is now, Brady can't seem to hit anybody reliably, unless it is the opposing team. I don't know why, but until the issue is corrected, its pie in the sky see him as the same player as in the SB years.

It is way more than Mangini being familiar with Brady, something is wrong, and just pretending it isn't won't make it go away.

Mo - this deserves your "Assclown" icon.

Some fans are un-friggin-believable. Bench Brady! Now I've heard it all. You would think it was Hugh Millen back there.

 

[BradyisGod]

Actually Tom isn't the 2nd best in the NFL. Cold Hard Football Facts have looked at the active QBs and Tom was #17 this year. When looking at how many TDs for the yards attempted, minus the interceptions. I dont know if that is before the Indy fiasco or after, but it certainly will go down with the Jets data.

You are living in the past when you talk about Brady being great. He was once, and I hope he will be again, but until that time, the team needs to move on and go with the best chance to win. Even if Cassel can't, it may fire up Tom, if he's injured it may let him rest, and in any event he can step back and look at things and get a handle on what is going wrong.

As it is now, Brady can't seem to hit anybody reliably, unless it is the opposing team. I don't know why, but until the issue is corrected, its pie in the sky see him as the same player as in the SB years.

It is way more than Mangini being familiar with Brady, something is wrong, and just pretending it isn't won't make it go away.

Wow, a lot of idiotic statements coming out after this loss.

Tell me how many times Peyton Manning has been benched after he's shat the bed? That's right. None.

Something tells me though, that you're probably not much older than 14, so we can let your idiocy slide.

 

[BelichickFan]

That is an indictment on the WR by committee experiment. They are not getting open, even as their QB faces down blitzes, or if they do get open they aren't getting sufficient seperation and he's having to throw it under pressure to where he thinks a defender can't get a hand on it and his WR's seem oblivious to that.

He needs to just throw it to the open WR then because there's been plenty of them. Many of his incompletions today were to WR that he just missed.

 

[Fanfrom1960]

No way. Our receivers were tremendous today. Even Gabriel's fumble was not in a bad spot - it was deep in Jets territory after he made a great play. On the whole the QB threw shallow passes and the receivers made nice plays...they even made some catches that were clearly off the mark.
Even taking the sacks Brady did, he showed no ability to step away or throw the ball away.
I would not let Brady off so easily here. He is a very very distant #2 to Manning and Pennington played a scrappy, cerebral game and outdueled him.
If the roles were reversed, we'd be singing the praises of Brady of how he 'took what the defense gave him' and played smart.
I am not saying to bench anyone...but the guy needs to tighten it up and I do not want to here any more criticism of our solid receiving corps.

There is no such thing as "not in a bad spot" to fumble. If you fumble deep in your opponent's territory, you are killing a chance for a TD, or at least a field goal. Those things happen to be the whole idea of playing the game.

 

[Drewwho]

He needs to just throw it to the open WR then because there's been plenty of them. Many of his incompletions today were to WR that he just missed.

How many incompletions did he have. I think he was over 60%...considering the weather that is not bad.

Last week he was 20-35...Manning was 20-36 did Manning miss wide open WR's??? My point is that there is more to incompletions than just missing guys. Brady does not just miss wide open guys - sure he does at times, but today's pass protection was HORRIBLE. Don't know about you, but when Brady walked off the field at the half you couldn't read the name off the back of his jersey, but it seemed our vaunted DL only sacked Pennington once or twice.

Brady is lucky not to be hurt in this game, but to some, that might as well be the answer for Cassel to come in and get us to the promise land.

 

[Drewwho]

He needs to just throw it to the open WR then because there's been plenty of them. Many of his incompletions today were to WR that he just missed.

How many incompletions did he have today? I think he was over 60%...considering the weather that is not horrible, is it?

Last week he was 20-35...Manning was 20-36 did Manning miss wide open WR's??? My point is that there is more to incompletions than just missing guys. Brady does not just miss wide open guys - sure he does at times, but today's pass protection was HORRIBLE. Don't know about you, but when Brady walked off the field at the half you couldn't read the name off the back of his jersey, but it seemed our vaunted DL only sacked Pennington once or twice.

Brady is lucky not to be hurt in this game, but to some, that might as well be the answer for Cassel to come in and get us to the promise land.

 

[Digger44]

Actually Tom isn't the 2nd best in the NFL. Cold Hard Football Facts have looked at the active QBs and Tom was #17 this year. When looking at how many TDs for the yards attempted, minus the interceptions. I dont know if that is before the Indy fiasco or after, but it certainly will go down with the Jets data.

You are living in the past when you talk about Brady being great. He was once, and I hope he will be again, but until that time, the team needs to move on and go with the best chance to win. Even if Cassel can't, it may fire up Tom, if he's injured it may let him rest, and in any event he can step back and look at things and get a handle on what is going wrong.

As it is now, Brady can't seem to hit anybody reliably, unless it is the opposing team. I don't know why, but until the issue is corrected, its pie in the sky see him as the same player as in the SB years.

It is way more than Mangini being familiar with Brady, something is wrong, and just pretending it isn't won't make it go away.

I agree 100%. We need to make this forum great by getting rid of some of the total idiot posters so this forum can be better. Maybe just ban them for a while to get them fired up so they can have better posts. It's way more than just an inlfux of Newbies who like to post absolute idiocy about benching a guy who is a 2x SB MVB and 3 time SB champion who is on the wrong side of 20. We need to ban newbies like you to see who we have sitting on the bench. Just pretending your post isnt here won't make it go away.

 

[NEPatriot]

Two things struck me about Tom. One, he continues to force the ball at the most inopportune times. Secondly, and more importat to me, he seems disintersted for large parts of the game. I don't seem that same fire that's been there when things where'nt going well. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[Halifax_Pats_Fan]

I agree 100%. We need to make this forum great by getting rid of some of the total idiot posters so this forum can be better. Maybe just ban them for a while to get them fired up so they can have better posts. It's way more than just an inlfux of Newbies who like to post absolute idiocy about benching a guy who is a 2x SB MVB and 3 time SB champion who is on the wrong side of 20. We need to ban newbies like you to see who we have sitting on the bench. Just pretending your post isnt here won't make it go away.

ha ha ha ha

 

[PatsSteve1]

I guess it's the American way that when things go wrong, it must be one thing that's to blame. A wise old fish once said, a QB gets too much credit when a team wins and too much blame when a team loses. IMO, just about the whole team, coaches on down, are out of sync. The DB's aren't playing that well or consistenly, nor are the WR's collectively or the OL either. The D wasn't very agrresive and except for the 2 wins over the Bengals and Vikings, both teams shown to be weaker than it appeared when the Patriots played them, the team hasn't been very consistent on O all year. I thought it strange that it keeps getting said about Brady getting used to the WR's yet today, the one who's been here the least time, Gaffney, he seemed to be in sync with the couple of times he threw to him. It's not 1 thing that's the problem. Teams win and teams lose. Optimistically there's still 7 games ti run it around. Pessimistically, as the games go by it's looking less likely they'll be SB strong. When a team is coming off a 2-14 season, winning your division and making the playoffs seems great. Doing that 2 years in a row then not getting to the Big Game seems disapointing. And will be disapointing.

 

[LasVegasPatsFan]

I am a huge Brady fan but this year he is not the same. In earlier years his enthusiasm has fueled this team to excel and we won. The QB is the cornerstone of the offense and his leadership determins how hard the other players play. I am not advocating that we bench Brady but have to look what the problems are whether it be a hidden injury or just not into the game. His throws this year are far from perfect and his completion percentage is only higher than M. Vick. Not worth writing home about. If bringing in Cassel will help, give it a shot. We would have never won the SB in 2001 had it not been for Mo Lewis's hit on Bledsoe. Bledsoe just did not rally this team the way the new guy (Brady) did. Sometimes teammates need a new leader to help spark the winning attitude. Looks as if Brady is loosing his winning attitude. Brady is a great QB but his performance this year indicates otherwise.

 

[Digger44]

If bringing in Cassel will help, give it a shot. We would have never won the SB in 2001 had it not been for Mo Lewis's hit on Bledsoe. Bledsoe just did not rally this team the way the new guy (Brady) did. Sometimes teammates need a new leader to help spark the winning attitude. Looks as if Brady is loosing his winning attitude. Brady is a great QB but his performance this year indicates otherwise.

How will bringing in Cassel help? Could someone please stand up and answer this question? How is Brady losing his winning attitude when the team is 6-3 this season? So we lost 2 games in a row, we are sitting in first place in our division and we have lost our winning attitude?????????? Maybe you should go back to being a fan for your other losing team whatever that may be. According to your logic, some of the greatest QB's of all time didnt have winning attitudes. Dan Marino ring a bell??? I hate to say it because I think Peyton is a total loser for my own reasons, but the guy is a great QB who has never won anything but still has a winning attitude. Instead of "sometimes teammates need a new leader" maybe it should be "sometimes dumb fans need to shut up and let these guys play ball."

 

[Bostonian1962]

I saw a segment early in the season where Chad Jackson approached Tom Brady and asked him to toss the ball around before the game and Tom declined but after though a bit and came out to throw the ball around with Jackson. Now Peyton Manning does it as a ritual before every game.

Remember how we use to bust on Drew Bledsoe for not trying to get better with his footwork? Tom Brady needs to get in sync with his damn WR's and he's to blame in my opinion, Why? I've never seen so many low balls, high balls and him throwing behind his WR's and TE's so dang much. It's becoming rare to see Tom hit a guy in stride. Thats whats wrong in my opinion.

I agree totally. It's like I'm watching a different QB. His throws have been all over the place. Even when he has all day to throw, and a great line of sight to the open receiver, the ball is low/high/behind. Plus, in the big games like Denver, Indy, and then with Eric M. coming home after a Pats loss, Brady laid eggs. Weird!

 

[PatsFanInVa]

I just saw this thread... yeah he does need to shoulder some blame, and I don't get the impression that he shirks it in any way. He said he got about 1 hour of sleep after the Indy game.

Everybody sees and knows the problem, it's not a secret. But you don't bench your 3 time SB winner for the young guy in the middle of a 6-3 season. Or for that matter, a 4-5 season. You MIGHT start thinking about it if you're 3-6. I can't say I'm a football expert, but I know enough to know that suggestion is just plain stupid.

Down times, rough patches, tough games, yadda yadda yadda. You know the drill. Sometimes you lose. It's a given. Some of us prefer to do our losing in the regular season rather than the post season (gratuitous swipe at Indy.)

Get off it, people. We're all entitled to opinions, but getting this offense in rhythm is the goal now, not throwing in monkey wrenches to assure that will never happen.

PFnV

 

[LasVegasPatsFan]

How is Brady losing his winning attitude when the team is 6-3 this season? "

Yes you are right, we are 6-3 againsts crap teams. We lost to 2 playoff teams and doubt we could even hang with the Chargers. Unless Brady gets out of his funk, we will have a short playoff run, if we even make it that far. Finally, this is a message board where Patriots fans can express their opinoins and we dont need fools like you to make comments such as "Go back to your other loosing team, whatever that may be". I am a dye hard Pats fan and have a right to express how I feel. I've watched every game this year including the pre-season and so far Brady has not been the same. As I said before, I am a huge Brady fan but can honestly say his performance this year is nothing spectacular. His deep throws are awful, his passes are rarely on target. forcing throws into double and sometimes triple coverages. Cant keep blaming his WR's because they have made great attempts to catch the ball thrown to them

 

[Drewwho]

OK, that is it, I am OUT of here for a while.
The continued, 'let's bring in Cassel and see what happens' crap has officially put me over the edge.

Patriot fans do not deserve a future HOF QB like Brady. As far as I am concerned he owes us NOTHING! This freak'in kid has won this once laughing stock franchise 3 SB's, went on a 21 game winning streak and up until this Sunday has not lost back to back games in 57 starts, AMAZING! Not to mention taking less than his market value to 'keep some of his guys' around (Geez, seems like going the route of Manning would have been wiser for Brady as Manning seems to have the same guys around year after year and they just get better and better - something to be said for continuity!)

This year, he is playing 8 home games on the worst field in the NFL, has all new WR's except for Brown, who on most teams would be a 4th or 5th stringer, and has inconsistent playing on the OL and in the TE postion (how many balls does Watson drop???) As far as RB's go - yeah, Maroney has shown 'signs' of greatness, but like Parcells always says, he is not ready to make the trip to Canton just yet. Not to mention the poor to horrible play calling from our friend Josh McDaniels who is obviously not ready for this big stage.

Sure I admit Brady has been off and at times looks like he is confused and even dejected, but do we think some of the above might, just might have something to do with it??? Losing Branch at the time he did I think shocked him and he has not adjusted to it to date...

So, that is it for me. I am out of here. I KNOW Brady is the best QB in the league (I would love to see Manning play behind this OL, on that field, with these weapons - now that would be fun!) and I KNOW Brady will get it together. The Pats are not a special team this year - but I still think we will win the division, and maybe a playoff game, but that will be it. I think that this season like the 2002 season will make Brady even better. Next year he will be 30 and I have to believe we move to field turf and sign a top knotch reciever or two. Sad thing is the Pats blew a year away of Brady's prime.

But to suggest benching him is just sad and reactionary from some stupid stupid stupid Pat fans!

 

[rtunstal]

Maybe the rumors during the off-season about Tom doing steroids just might be true. I don?t truly know if I believe it, but he seams not to have that fire in his eyes anymore. He is one of the best QB?s in the game today he just doesn?t seem to playing like it.

Now I know I am going to get a bunch of flack for this and that?s fine, but something is wrong and we, as fans need to look at it from outside the box. This excuse of him not getting in sync with his wide receivers is crazy. Just look at Drew Breeze he has a whole new receiving cast playing for a whole ?NEW TEAM? so lets stop all this BS about him needing to get used to all these new receivers.

Josh McDaniel?s does need to adjust his play calling. He needs to design plays that his QB and WR can actually do, not all this fancy stuff they are using. Charlie?s old playbook is just that old he needs to rewrite it to use with this receiving crop. That?s what Charlie did; he did it to maximize his receiver?s good attributes. Not all receivers are the same. Brady text Hasselbeck about the plays that work best for Deion and that is what Josh must do for this WR crop to succeed? He must learn to play all of these great players on this team to their strengths and develop their weakness on the practice field not during game time.