How To Salvage This Season?

[TheRazorsEdge]

Keep fighting until the fat lady sings...and I didn't hear no bell.

LFG Pats!

 

[EMpats]

If one out of the 3 of Boutte, Reagor and Thornton show they can be a starting caliber receiver to complement Douglas going forward, it will make the offensive rebuild much easier. Having two young pieces would mean they can focus on acquiring one high caliber receiver and a tight end.

If they end up in the 5-8 range in the draft, I love the idea of drafting Brock Bowers to be our Kelce but a version who can block like a real tight end.

 

[n6249c]

We obsess about the blue chip player thing and quantity too much. Super Bowl contenders are going to have on average 4-6 "blue chip" players. For our most recent SB runs that was Brady, Gronk, McCourty, Hightower, Thuney, and Revis (2014), Gilmore (2018). It's the middle part of the roster where you need to be good and deep. We have that on defense but not at all on offense. I do believe the OL is coming together, and that may be the bastion of optimism for next season, but every other part of the offense needs drastic improvements.

Agree with obsessing too much about blue chip players.

I think the OL is the root of the problem this year, because of injuries starting even before camp. Onwenu has been recovering from off season surgery, until just recently. Strange was injured at the start of camp and hasn’t been right since. Reiff and Anderson were acquired to be the answer at RT, opposite Trent who has been doing a good job at LT, and they’ve both been hurt or sick all season. It’s been a hospital ward all season. Starting to come together, but not soon enough.

RB and TE are least of the problems on offense. With a healthy OL they’d be good enough. No need for “drastic improvements” with either. Some additional RB depth would be nice, but not a drastic need. Pharaoh looks to be a good find at TE, so I’d like to see him get a multi year extension (3 yrs would be good),

WR corps has underperformed, and might look much better if the OL were not such a total shambles. WR is still not outstanding, but it’s hard to tell if they could be good enough if the QB doesn’t give them a fighting chance. Or, could have been good enough, before Bourne went down. For next year, Bourne and Pop provide a good nucleus, with contributions expected from Boutte, Reagor, and TT. Upgrades from Juju and Parker are much needed, but I’m not seeing the need for a drastic makeover there.

QB is the other glaring weakness, apart from OL, on that side of the ball.

How many weeks has Mac said “I have to play better”?
How many weeks has Mac actually played better than the previous week?
Case closed.

So I’m seeing QB as the one drastic improvement needed on offense.

 

[venecol]

I understood it as a contextually pertinent point: Parker has drawn the ire of many here for not showing up when needed and JJSS has done next to nothing given his hype. It would seem that Douglas would slide up the depth chart given the circumstances. I could be wrong.

FWIW, I personally don't want to count JJSS out just yet, but something hasn't been panning out. Hopefully he rights that course quickly.

Who do you think is WR1 right now?

If healthy, JJSS.

 

[Vindicate]

I keep hearing people say "he must be injured" because he sucks so bad. I think he just sucks. He has a history of foot/toe issues, knee issues, and multiple concussions. His body is breaking down on him and even though he is young he has a ton of wear and tear on him and it shows.

I will say, I feel like Juju wasn't the same receiver after he got trucked early in that Bengals game a few years back after dancing on their logo. I swear that shook him a bit. You could also look at that moment and say that's when the ship started to sink in Pittsburgh.

 

[Vindicate]

If healthy, JJSS.

I hope so. I'd love for him to pan out. I feel like he was doing well in camp, so I've been surprised at his season thus far.

 

[State]

Beer

 

[n6249c]

Beer

Strong liquor

 

[Real fan 02]

Admit that Mac isn't the answer.

I think it's pretty evident..

 

[Real fan 02]

I hope so. I'd love for him to pan out. I feel like he was doing well in camp, so I've been surprised at his season thus far.

He said himself he wasn't ever 100%.. he said he was in discomfort playing in the superbowl. The team was managing him during the off season. He was signed knowingly about his injury. He's a far better player that what he's displayed.

 

[203Pat]

I’m with you on that.

It‘s the same argument I was making about re-signing Uche and Onwenu et al instead of trading them for draft picks. The replacements drafted might be cheaper but they‘re not as skilled until they have a few years development, plus there’s the risk they won’t develop as foreseen/hoped. Exhibit A: Mac Jones.

I’d favor keeping all of Dugger, Onwenu, and Uche, unless some other team goes crazy throwing much more than top of the market money at any of them.

I think this is an area where Bill’s undergrad degree works against him. At contract renewal time he tends to undervalue players that were drafted and developed in his system, relative to the overall NFL market. Flip side of that, he tends to overvalue the net present value of newly drafted rookies about to be developed in his system, by not discounting sufficiently for risk. Some of it may be overestimating the value and expected results of coaching within the Patriots system. For example, expecting the 2023 OL rookies to be developed as well as they would be if Scar were still here. So he doesn’t want to pay as much to retain homegrown talent as the rest of the league will pay to steal it away from him. There may also be a willingness by other teams to pay a premium for talent developed under Belichick, that he’s not willing to pay because he expects he can develop the next crop as well. That’s where having his staff poached (or retire, e.g. Scar) hurts, as it diminished the ability to develop as well.
TL;DR: Pats need to do better at paying enough to re-sign homegrown talent.

I am completely with you here and I just don't understand Bill's logic. You have a guy who you handpicked to be on your team. You coached him up, developed his skills, and just as he's going to hit his prime you let him walk and bring in a new guy from either the draft or free agency you hope can at least be better than the last guy. Maybe he thinks "If player X can succeed with that coach/scheme/surrounding cast imagine what I can do with him". Bill just seems to be creating headaches for himself with building the roster by constantly playing musical chairs with certain positions when he could just keep the guys he has and move onto other areas of the roster.

Judon. Trent Brown.

Judon I would say is a blue chip player but he is going to miss most of the year and be 32 next season. Brown has blue chip talent but I would never give him a long term deal as he gets fat and happy.

yes, sarcasm, responding to posts that keep on saying that juju isn't injured

I don't know what your point is? You think he's playing poorly because he's injured or because he's a bad player?

 

[Triumph]

Admit that Mac isn't the answer.

It's amazing how many still believe in Corky.

Boston loves a hard luck story with a happy outcome.

 

[amfootball]

It's amazing how many still believe in Corky.

Boston loves a hard luck story with a happy outcome.

I think it's more that fans really wanted Bill to find the next guy as soon as Brady left to prove it really was the system ...

 

[venecol]

I think it's more that fans really wanted Bill to find the next guy as soon as Brady left to prove it really was the system ...

This. It's about taking the absolutist position that if Bill picked them, then it must be the right choice because "dynasty." How dare you question him? @Ice_Ice_Brady posted a comment from one of his staunchest defenders slamming a poster that dared question Bill signing Isaiah Ford. Lol, the level of delusion among Team Bill is clinical.

 

[n6249c]

This. It's about taking the absolutist position that if Bill picked them, then it must be the right choice because "dynasty." How dare you question him? @Ice_Ice_Brady posted a comment from one of his staunchest defenders slamming a poster that dared question Bill signing Isaiah Ford. Lol, the level of delusion among Team Bill is clinical.

I think that’s too simplistic. It’s seeing everything as black and white in a technicolor world. The whole “Team Bill” vs “Team Tom” dichotomy is a red herring. It’s possible to admire either, or even both of them, without picking sides. Picking sides serves only to divide us, and promote fights among us. Please grow up and get over that.

As far as why some folks still haven’t given up on Corky, I think it’s because picking him in the draft was such a positive. He was highly regarded. He said the right things. He had a great pedigree. He was happy to be here, and we were happy to have him.

some folks recovered from that dopamine hit and saw reality faster than others.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

It's amazing how many still believe in Corky.

Boston loves a hard luck story with a happy outcome.

There's a difference in believing he's the answer and knowing he's really the only option right now, although I'd like to see what Grier can do when he's up to speed.

 

[Fatmancryin]

I think they go 7-2 to close out the season and miss the playoffs. They will be picking in the middle 12-15 range.

As most of us want to tank, I just don’t think it’s in BB DNA to do that.

 

[Wozzy]

I think it's more that fans really wanted Bill to find the next guy as soon as Brady left to prove it really was the system ...

Mac had some good traits exiting college, he was accurate and won games, he won in big moments. In hindsight, a lot of that success has to do with being on a college superteam.

The only way a pro team can properly gauge a rookie is to get them in the building and try them out. This is why the draft is a crapshoot. I don’t think a single team who drafted a QB in that 2021 draft class is happy with the result… that’s the nature of the draft.

Screw it… draft another QB, draft two. The draft is a crapshoot, you only lose if you stop playing.

 

[Fatmancryin]

Mac had some good traits exiting college, he was accurate and won games, he won in big moments. In hindsight, a lot of that success has to do with being on a college superteam.

The only way a pro team can properly gauge a rookie is to get them in the building and try them out. This is why the draft is a crapshoot. I don’t think a single team who drafted a QB in that 2021 draft class is happy with the result… that’s the nature of the draft.

Screw it… draft another QB, draft two. The draft is a crapshoot, you only lose if you stop playing.

Agree!! How many teams in the league waited years and years to find a franchise QB? There are still some teams in league that still don’t have a franchise QB and those teams were picking fairly early in the 1st rounds.

Macs strengths in college have not transitioned in the NFL. That most likely is due to nfl 1st 2nd round talent that was on the offense. I think I read somewhere that he had at least 12 nfl drafted players on that Alabama offense.

 

[Real fan 02]

Mac had some good traits exiting college, he was accurate and won games, he won in big moments. In hindsight, a lot of that success has to do with being on a college superteam.

The only way a pro team can properly gauge a rookie is to get them in the building and try them out. This is why the draft is a crapshoot. I don’t think a single team who drafted a QB in that 2021 draft class is happy with the result… that’s the nature of the draft.

Screw it… draft another QB, draft two. The draft is a crapshoot, you only lose if you stop playing.

Trevor Lawrence?? I'd imagine at 6-2 JAX is pretty happy. But I agree your right on that. MAC is never going to excel here with this organization in its current state. But solely becuase he cheap they will ride out his rookie salary and allow him to go elsewhere in FA. It probably best for him and the organization.